Josh Langel
Well-Known Member
Aaahhh.. your welcome Mark.
Sometimes I really hate wally mart!
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Aaahhh.. your welcome Mark.
Bill V
Well-Known Member
Yeah, that is interesting. I have never seen a Walmart that sells fresh food. Some of the ones here do have a "grocery" section, but it's only stuff that can have an extended shelf life--canned and boxed goods, etc. Definitely no fresh veggies. Whereas around here, I estimate that about 2/3 of the Targets are "SuperTarget"s, with a complete grocery section, including fresh produce, deli, its own meat department, etc.
The only time I'm ever in a Walmart these days is because one of them within driving range is a 24 hour store--so if there's an urgent need for something when Target is closed, I can head there. But when that happens, it's me that makes the run, not my wife, as neither she or I feel that it's safe for her to be alone in their parking lot after sunset.
Jim Reeves
Active Member
I guess it depends on where you are, Bill V. My old school buddies and I make an annual camping trip to the Mountains of NC, and camp off the Blue Ridge Parkway near a little town called Spruce Pine. They have a Super Wal-Mart that does indeed have a grocery complete with a rather sizeable produce section. They also have a fresh (at least it seems to be) meat and fish market. We have a new Wal-Mart in my hometown. Very new and thus far, fairly clean with a nice big parking lot and lots of landscaping. I don't make a habit of shopping there, but not for any lofty socio-economic reason. I just don't like the crowds, and I'm not very fond of the quality of goods they sell. Every job I have ever had, I was offered a wage before I took the job. It was up to me whether i took the job or not at that wage. As long as the people I work for abide by labor laws and treat me like a human being and pay me the wage they promised, I don't see that I have a gripe. If I think that I'm worth more than they are willing to pay me, I should get another job. If I refuse to work because i think they should pay me more than they think I'm worth, they should fire me on the spot. I agreed to take the job and I agreed to do the job. I think you should do your best because it's the right thing to do, not because of how much you are being paid.
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Bill V
Well-Known Member
I'd modify that list slightly here.
Local Dump -> KMart -> WalMart -> Local Flea market -> Target -- and continuing from there, -> JCPenney/Kohl's (tie) -> Dayton's (sorry, but like most Minnesota residents, I refuse to call it Macy's, or even Marshall Fields)
Mark Grumpy
Well-Known Member
Bill, which was there first - the crime or the Wally World? Or did they arrive together. Interesting.
My local Wally was built after I bought my house. I have no issues. My daughter worked in the McD's inside the Wally and often left after midnight to come home. I was no more concerned than at any other time when your teen is driving.
Like your SuperTarget, these are often called Super WalMarts. They have full groceries - dairy, delis, specialties, bakeries, optometrist, pharmacy, the works. Although I have seen non Super WalMarts in the past that did not do groceries, I do not know of any around here. They are all 24 hours.
Must just be geographical. I'm thinking hard, but you know, I don't recall seeing any severely handicapped employees as implied above. I'm sure there are handicapped/disabled folks there, I don't really know. Maybe the quality of employment changes too by region and store district. Maybe here, it's not such a bad place to work. Again, Interesting.
grump
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I can't stand any of those "Superstores" -- Walmart, Target, Meijer (for those of you in the Michigan/Ohio area), K-mart. I literally get tightness in my chest when I go in there. They are a mess, sell generally cheap, low quality crap, workers are usually unfriendly and/or clueless, and you have to stand in line for 1/2 hour to pay for anything despite the fact that there are 20 registers -- only 2 are open.
And the big kicker to me -- and this is based on my own personal theories -- I think that people get dumber as soon as they walk into the place. I think anytime people gather anywhere in mass, they get dumber, but again, that is one of my theories.
Give me a small local store anytime -- granted, I'll pay more, but my blood pressure stays lower.
Rocks
And the big kicker to me -- and this is based on my own personal theories -- I think that people get dumber as soon as they walk into the place. I think anytime people gather anywhere in mass, they get dumber, but again, that is one of my theories.
Give me a small local store anytime -- granted, I'll pay more, but my blood pressure stays lower.
Rocks
Jeff C
Well-Known Member
I needed to go to the store this morning at 1am. Who was open? Wal-Mart, and that's it.
Key word in "minimum wage" is "minimum". If it wasn't enough, they wouldn't call it the minimum.
Anyone else see "Penn and Teller's Bullsh!t" last night. It was actually on how it's bullsh!t to hate Wal-Mart. Average employee gets paid $10.15 / hour, about $5 more than the minimum. Starting pay was around $8 / hour.
Key word in "minimum wage" is "minimum". If it wasn't enough, they wouldn't call it the minimum.
Anyone else see "Penn and Teller's Bullsh!t" last night. It was actually on how it's bullsh!t to hate Wal-Mart. Average employee gets paid $10.15 / hour, about $5 more than the minimum. Starting pay was around $8 / hour.
Wal-Mart is one of the few companies that averages their CEO's and upper managment pay into everyones pay...you know to bring the average up.
It makes them look better that way.
Tom
It makes them look better that way.
Tom
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
Caymen, you tout the praises of Penn and Teller, did you see their ep on WalMart haters being BS?
TJR
TJR
Steve Peterson
Member
This is a Capitalist society...not Socialist. Nobody has ever forced an employee at Wal-Mart to work there. If you don't like the pay, leave and find a better paying job. It's what people do every day all across America, lower class, middle class and upper class. It's really quite simple.
Bill V
Well-Known Member
I honestly don't know. Both where there prior to me moving to that portion of the Twin Cities area. However, I can say that I haven't felt unsafe at any of the dozens of Targets in the area I've been to in my life, while I haven't felt truly safe at any of the roughly half dozen Walmarts in the area. It does feel like more than a coincidence, although I don't really have any hard evidence to back that up.
TJR,
I am going to watch it now. I will watch both sides and can agree to agree or dis-agree with them.
Tom
I am going to watch it now. I will watch both sides and can agree to agree or dis-agree with them.
Tom
Caymen,
Every company includes their CEO in the Average Pay, Thats only one persons pay out of probably a few hundred thousand employees world wide. That does not raise average wage that much.
The minimum wage applies to people who have no skills or minimal education. If someone goes to work for Wal-Mart who has some skills or experience like a cashier, payroll clerk, etc, they will get paid more than the minimum wage.
Many years ago, my daughter worked for Wal-Mart. She started out ar a new store before it opened and was controling the inventory coming into the store. Later she moved to the office where she loaded price changes into the UPC code computer and also handled the payroll/timecards, etc. She had previously worked at K-Mart in similar positions so she did start at a higher jpay than the minimum wage.
I don't know what the salary of Wal-Mart's CEO, I do agree that many CEO's are way overpaid, especially if they are publicly traded companies. That's why I like the Japanese law that limits CEO salary to 10X the salary of the lowest paid worker in the company.
In the US, I think we should limit CEO's to 12X or 15X the salary of the lowest paid employee as long as the employee is making at least the minimum wage. The CEO salary limit should be based on total compensation including Bonuses, and Stock options, etc, unless all workers also receive a proportional share in the Bonuses, Profit Sharing, and stock options.
...Rich
Every company includes their CEO in the Average Pay, Thats only one persons pay out of probably a few hundred thousand employees world wide. That does not raise average wage that much.
The minimum wage applies to people who have no skills or minimal education. If someone goes to work for Wal-Mart who has some skills or experience like a cashier, payroll clerk, etc, they will get paid more than the minimum wage.
Many years ago, my daughter worked for Wal-Mart. She started out ar a new store before it opened and was controling the inventory coming into the store. Later she moved to the office where she loaded price changes into the UPC code computer and also handled the payroll/timecards, etc. She had previously worked at K-Mart in similar positions so she did start at a higher jpay than the minimum wage.
I don't know what the salary of Wal-Mart's CEO, I do agree that many CEO's are way overpaid, especially if they are publicly traded companies. That's why I like the Japanese law that limits CEO salary to 10X the salary of the lowest paid worker in the company.
In the US, I think we should limit CEO's to 12X or 15X the salary of the lowest paid employee as long as the employee is making at least the minimum wage. The CEO salary limit should be based on total compensation including Bonuses, and Stock options, etc, unless all workers also receive a proportional share in the Bonuses, Profit Sharing, and stock options.
...Rich
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
I just watched the latest Penn and Teller Bullshit episode, the one about WalMart hating being bullshit.
As usual, the guys speak some wickedly convincing truths.
TJR
As usual, the guys speak some wickedly convincing truths.
TJR
One thing they never spoke of was talking about Wal-Mart using overseas child labor. There isn;t so much bad with Child labor or sweat shops, but the fact is when overseas countries get that work, inflation goes up so quickly and prices rise so high, that those that get the work actully suffer because of that.
Tom
Tom
Maurice Garcia
Member
My sister in law is mentally retarded. I live in Cali and she works through a work program adminstered by our Regional Centers - they provide services except educatrion from Pre-
school to 18 years of age which is the school districts responsibility. She has worked at several places including GoodWill Industries. She has a case worker and her job and labor rates are pre-negotiated by law.
Most of you are talking out of your ass about mentally handicapped workers. There are laws both state and most importantly federal. They are powerful laws and companies and school districts are afraid of them.
Mu 8 year old son had Down's Syndrome. He has a mental capacity that is roughly always run about 1/2 of his physical age. We wanted him to have an adult assistant (teacher) that could help him at school - academic, social, bathroom, etc. THe LAUSD did not want to provide him with one because it's their budget. One call to the regional center and a request for an IEP and they have to prove why he doesn't need one. The LAUSD has to comply with a IEP and when it is given or risk being not in compliance with federal law.
Same thing with my sister in law. She gets a small check for herself and the rest is taken care of by social security. She doesn't know how much she makes and it doesn't matter. She loves saying that she goes to work and has money to spend to buy ice cream or a CD. Companies may get cheap labor but they have to comply with many regulations and laws to do so. If there is a problem at work for example they must call her legal guardian, my wife in this case. She cannot be fired, she CAN be removed from the job and given a placement in another department or another company - only after review of course.
Cheers,
Maurice
PS I shop at our new SuperWalmart on occasion (read rarely). But it reminds me of Costco - they only have what they have and that's it. We frequent small mom-and-pops as much as we can. I guess that anti-union to some of you too:
school to 18 years of age which is the school districts responsibility. She has worked at several places including GoodWill Industries. She has a case worker and her job and labor rates are pre-negotiated by law.
Most of you are talking out of your ass about mentally handicapped workers. There are laws both state and most importantly federal. They are powerful laws and companies and school districts are afraid of them.
Mu 8 year old son had Down's Syndrome. He has a mental capacity that is roughly always run about 1/2 of his physical age. We wanted him to have an adult assistant (teacher) that could help him at school - academic, social, bathroom, etc. THe LAUSD did not want to provide him with one because it's their budget. One call to the regional center and a request for an IEP and they have to prove why he doesn't need one. The LAUSD has to comply with a IEP and when it is given or risk being not in compliance with federal law.
Same thing with my sister in law. She gets a small check for herself and the rest is taken care of by social security. She doesn't know how much she makes and it doesn't matter. She loves saying that she goes to work and has money to spend to buy ice cream or a CD. Companies may get cheap labor but they have to comply with many regulations and laws to do so. If there is a problem at work for example they must call her legal guardian, my wife in this case. She cannot be fired, she CAN be removed from the job and given a placement in another department or another company - only after review of course.
Cheers,
Maurice
PS I shop at our new SuperWalmart on occasion (read rarely). But it reminds me of Costco - they only have what they have and that's it. We frequent small mom-and-pops as much as we can. I guess that anti-union to some of you too:
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
Caymen said:
Actually, Caymen, they talked about that for about 5 minutes during the show.
The points made were:
1) The children and their families are THANKFUL to have the jobs
2) Such jobs pay much more on average than other domestic jobs
3) If not for these jobs then children in these countries would more than likely work worse jobs, for less money; jobs like prostitution.
4) The countries that are developing these goods are not unlike our own country 100 years ago where children worked such jobs in large cities; and like our own country, such industry fueled our growth and prosperity (the industrial revolution).
As you say, such work fuels the local economies of these growing countries, and that means inflation. Still, I disagree that those working in the "sweat shops" are then "left behind". It didn't happen in our country; it didn't happen in prospering parts of China, or India.
Here is the clip from P&T Bullshit:
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TJR
Actually, Caymen, they talked about that for about 5 minutes during the show.
The points made were:
1) The children and their families are THANKFUL to have the jobs
2) Such jobs pay much more on average than other domestic jobs
3) If not for these jobs then children in these countries would more than likely work worse jobs, for less money; jobs like prostitution.
4) The countries that are developing these goods are not unlike our own country 100 years ago where children worked such jobs in large cities; and like our own country, such industry fueled our growth and prosperity (the industrial revolution).
As you say, such work fuels the local economies of these growing countries, and that means inflation. Still, I disagree that those working in the "sweat shops" are then "left behind". It didn't happen in our country; it didn't happen in prospering parts of China, or India.
Here is the clip from P&T Bullshit:
<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/hjsshqyAFh8"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hjsshqyAFh8" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object>
TJR
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Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
Mo2k, thanks for chiming in and affirming my assumptions.
BTW, when you said "Most of you are talking out of your ass about mentally handicapped workers", just remember, talking out of one's ass is a handicap as well.
TJR
BTW, when you said "Most of you are talking out of your ass about mentally handicapped workers", just remember, talking out of one's ass is a handicap as well.
TJR
Josh Langel
Well-Known Member
I still stand my ground when I say that Wal Mart takes advantage of it's mentally handicapped workers.
When I worked at Winn Dixie as a teenager, I had quite a few mentally handicapped coworkers. I also had a boss that tried to persuade me to stay on the clock past my legal time or to clock out and remain working. I AM SURE, because I saw it, that those (not all) with a hard time communicating were pursuaded to work when they didnt.
Sorry, floks, but I worked at a place that did take advantage of them, so I have a hard time believing that Wal Mart is any better, especially with their high number of handicapped workers.I still stand my ground when I say that Wal Mart takes advantage of it's mentally handicapped workers.
Sorry, folks, but I worked at a place that did take advantage of them, so I have a hard time believing that Wal Mart is any better, especially with their high number of handicapped workers.
BTW, I'm talking from my mouth... the only sounds that come from my ass are tooty-sounding farts. :lol:
When I worked at Winn Dixie as a teenager, I had quite a few mentally handicapped coworkers. I also had a boss that tried to persuade me to stay on the clock past my legal time or to clock out and remain working. I AM SURE, because I saw it, that those (not all) with a hard time communicating were pursuaded to work when they didnt.
Sorry, floks, but I worked at a place that did take advantage of them, so I have a hard time believing that Wal Mart is any better, especially with their high number of handicapped workers.I still stand my ground when I say that Wal Mart takes advantage of it's mentally handicapped workers.
Sorry, folks, but I worked at a place that did take advantage of them, so I have a hard time believing that Wal Mart is any better, especially with their high number of handicapped workers.
BTW, I'm talking from my mouth... the only sounds that come from my ass are tooty-sounding farts. :lol:
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Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
Mud said:
How long ago was the Mud (that you were a teenager)?
So again, your assumption is that since you observed first-hand one company a few years ago trying to take advantage of capable, teen workers, that WalMart must today have a big problem with taking advantage of handicapped workers the same way.
Sorry, I don't see the connection.
If anything, I see it as LESS likely that a handicapped person would be asked to work overtime off the clock, or to work past a legal or expected stop time. WHY do I say that? Because anyone that is severely handicapped and can't stand up for themselves also doesn't have flexible time to work late. They typically have scheduled para-transit, or some other person or support system that will be dropping them off and picking them up, or be on some other sort of very fixed schedule that cannot be disrupted, and IF IT WERE disrupted, lots of people would be questioning WalMart managers as to WHY that happened.
Nope, it just doesn't sound like a well thought-out conviction you have there, Mud...it's about as clear as, well, ah, Mud.
TJR
How long ago was the Mud (that you were a teenager)?
So again, your assumption is that since you observed first-hand one company a few years ago trying to take advantage of capable, teen workers, that WalMart must today have a big problem with taking advantage of handicapped workers the same way.
Sorry, I don't see the connection.
If anything, I see it as LESS likely that a handicapped person would be asked to work overtime off the clock, or to work past a legal or expected stop time. WHY do I say that? Because anyone that is severely handicapped and can't stand up for themselves also doesn't have flexible time to work late. They typically have scheduled para-transit, or some other person or support system that will be dropping them off and picking them up, or be on some other sort of very fixed schedule that cannot be disrupted, and IF IT WERE disrupted, lots of people would be questioning WalMart managers as to WHY that happened.
Nope, it just doesn't sound like a well thought-out conviction you have there, Mud...it's about as clear as, well, ah, Mud.
TJR
