RAM Air Intake Maybe???

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the MAF will detect a little bit of the flow difference but it depends on the size and shape of the area around the MAF. whats gonna happens is your gonna forces a lot more air than neccessary into a part that is too small to take it all and you going to notice no real gains performance wise. I believe. im not expert however.
 
Bill, I'm trying to understand what you are saying. Ram air basically puts a high pressure head of air at the inlet of the snorkel. The faster you go, the larger the head. The velocity of air through the snorkel is a function of the differential pressure at both ends, i.e the base of the throttle body and the snorkel. there should be no problem with detecting the amount of flow through the MAF. Where does my logic go wrong?
 
Mike

Your MAF is not calbrated for ram air, air flow, perhaps it could be, but without a total retune, is not going to be of any use on an OEM NA engine as we have.

Yours and others thinking works for carbed engines, is anciant tech.

Not applicable today

Add more airflow, use a hair dryer, your engine will die.
 
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Bill, not to beat a dead horse but the amount of additional air that a ram air would add to the normal amount of air (non-ram) is not a hell of a lot. Actually the differences are only going to be noticeable at high speed. The normal range of the MAF should be adequate to handle the additional flow. We are not talking about a turbo or blower here. My redline on my Z3 was changed by 500 rpm almost a 10% increase. At 7000 more air is being "swallowed" than at 6500. The MAF has no problem understanding the 10% increase in air flow. Ram air probably would not get you a 10% increase, so why do you feel that it could not handle it in a 4.0 engine?
 
Well Bill, a 10% increase in air means a 10% increase in fuel can be thrown in. That means more HP. If spending a couple of hundred on undersized pulleys to gain 1 or 2 HP is OK, why does a few feet of tubing to gain a HP or 2 not worth it. I am not talking about hood mods and such. I'm talking about catching some air from the front of the fascia or below. I have not looked at the locations relative to piping but the two fogs could be removed and replaced with air intakes.



Bill my response to you was not questioning the bang for the buck, but to understand why you said it would not work.
 
They don't sell, because they are the proverbial tits on a boar.

But Psycareyo will buy one if found.





Huh?



Seriously man, your comments just seem completely opionion and largely false.
 
psycareyo,



To quote something, all you have to do is copy the text you want to quote, click the "quote" button (next to the underlined U) and paste the text between the ] and the [ in the tag. ;)



Not trying to be rude or anything, it's just that reading your posts sometimes can get confusing without the quote box. :D
 
I think Mike C understand what im going for...... basicly its a snorkle of sorts... not that it is any higher.... but its going to get direct air from the outside of the car..... not from the box inside the engine compartment.... now Train

First, the MAF won't connect directly to the intake, because you have the throttle body between the MAF and the intake.



Second, it would still be offset from center, because the intake to TB connection angles out towards the passenger side.



Look more closely at your engine again, and you'll see that it just won't work the way you'd like for it to...
Click to expand...



I have looked at my engine... i do know what it looks like..... Im not dumb... i see what needs to be done.... as a Engineering major these projects are what i do.... Take what i want, then look at what i have, and then make the nessicary modifications and fabrication to achieve what my goal is..... all i gota do is put some SHORT piping that has a bend in it..... boom its going straight up.....



THE WHOLE IDEA OF THE CONCEPT PROJECT IS TO GET AIR DIRECTLY FROM THE OUTSIDE OF THE CAR TO THE INTAKE........ NO/MINIMAL AIR FROM INSIDE OF ENGINE COMPARTMENT... SURE ITS A LITTLE REDICULUS FOR WHAT THE RESULTS COULD BE BUT YOU KNOW WHAT... SO BE IT... IT JUST MIGHT TURN OUT TO BE THE NEXT BEST MOD....



Now as for this big talk about increased airflow will kill the motor.... well the filter is going to slow down a good bit of the speed so pretty much its gona be the same as if i had a Zabteck cold air intake and was going down the hwy at 90 mph or down the neighborhood at 25.... its not gona matter
 
ST Sails,



So, you're just going to do essentially what the ZabTek CAI is doing; only make it look purdy. Got it. ;)



Bill,



I also undersand what you are saying about attempting to put more air through the MAFS than what it is programmed to read. Does that mean the the C&L MAFS housing is pointless?
 
Roger, a larger MAf housing is almost pointless IMO.

ST Sails, good luck on your project, pls keep us posted on your success or lack there of.
 
I have looked at my engine... i do know what it looks like..... Im not dumb... i see what needs to be done.... as a Engineering major these projects are what i do.... Take what i want, then look at what i have, and then make the nessicary modifications and fabrication to achieve what my goal is..... all i gota do is put some SHORT piping that has a bend in it..... boom its going straight up.....
Click to expand...



ST Sails,



I wasn't implying that you were dumb. But when you proposed this idea, as it was written

Remove the long hose that connects the current intake filter..... shorting it to about right out of the intake... go up..... cut hole in hood... add filters and hood scoop....
Click to expand...

you made no mention of the throttle body or MAF housing whatsoever, leading the reader to believe that you intended to connect the intake pipe directly to the manifold. And by making your idea analogous to carbureted cars,

Like the classic cars that have the carborators on the top... do something like that except almost straight from the intake...
Click to expand...

you created a visual in the reader's minds of a hole in the center of the hood with a scoop on it. At least that's how I pictured your concept, because as I recall, on most, if not all, V-type carbureted engines, the carburetor is in the center of the intake. So I was picturing a hole and scoop in the middle of the hood. That's just not possible on the ST with it's intake design.



If you could provide a little more detail regarding your idea, that might give me a better picture. Because I don't think you'd be able to get the look that I believe you're trying to achieve. If you factor both the throttle body and the MAF housing, that would put your air filter and possible ram air hole about six inches down from center, and at an angle out towards the passenger's front corner of the hood.



Even on vehicles like the Mustang that have a functional ram air hood scoop like aftermarket shaker scoops, there's a liner on the underside of the hood or plastic tubing that acts as a channel to route the air to the filter where it's housed in the engine compartment. If it was possible to eliminate the air intake tubing and have a more direct ram air setup, I think that the aftermarket engineers would've come up with something by now, given the huge demand for Mustang performance parts.



If I'm way off base on this, maybe it's because I'm the dumb one. If, as you say,

i see what needs to be done.... as a Engineering major these projects are what i do.... Take what i want, then look at what i have, and then make the nessicary modifications and fabrication to achieve what my goal is
Click to expand...

then provide me with more details as to how you hope to achieve this goal.



And if you're successful, by all means, submit it to this site for publication as a project and share pictures with all of us. I'm sure many here would be anxious to see your results. Good luck.
 
I stayed out of this as long as I can,LOL. Not all cars or engines benifit the same. The but is that it will work. The stock maf will read the air charge. I wouldnt expect 10% gain. I have built ram airs for many cars. The benifit is that it keeps the air box charged with cooler outside air at all times, especialy summer time. Not knocking the zabtek CAI but it is one step above that. Any real performance gain is only noticed at 40 mph and above.

I say if you choose to design one go for it. The only reason I havent, is space limitation. I have looked it over. I choose not to do some cutting on my trac to route a decent system. The shaker hood is too much $$ for the benifit.

I just dont understand why you have recieved more argument than Ideas..;)
 
Eddie

The Ram airs you have built for many cars, Carbed?

You have a Scangauge, Drive the ST down the hwy, you will note that the IAT is the same as the ambiant temp, It cannot get any colder.

As far as open intakes, a CAI do's not exsist, you IATs at H'way speed will be at ambiant with any open intake.

Eddie your an old racer, you know what the numbers are, for every 10 degs you can lower the intake charge, you gain 1 H.P., no biggie.
 
Bill, If the scangauge is correct my air charge runs at 135 to 140 at highway speed. At 165 around town. I even have a fan air block for the K&N conical open filter. Iam in the process of designing a box like the volant system has.



edit; this photo is before the air blocker for the fan..



[Broken External Image]:
 
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Eddie

My IAT at h'way speed on a 70 deg day is 70 degs via SG.I have gone as far as to use med grade needle probes inserted thru the silicone connectors on my EE intake, same numbers.

Have measuerd underhood temps using probes and yellowsprings temp indicators.

Same result at H'way speeds.

hard to believe your IAT at speed is so High, mine only get that high stop and go traffic.
 
2 points:



1) As for the ram air thing..... Paul H and i were working on making his hood scoop functional, We have all the piping, special bends and hood flange to do it.....

Unfortunately Paul is pre occupied and we have not worked on fabricating it on to his truck...



As for the MAF air flow, the MAF will be relocated to the little extra air will not throw the sensor off and stall the truck...... That point bill is right... You would need to convert to a blow through MAF to prevent any stalling if the air goes past the MAF too fast or with turblance.......



2)Bill,



I have done the cold air tests on over 4 ST's here.... Eddies numbers are close to what i got on all 4 trucks....



All trucks were with OEM stock intakes, OPEN filters and then My CAI.....



Further more... It seems to me that your trying to prove every product that I sell to be negative and wrthless....

I have dyno numbers and tests and Plenty of happy customers with my products...



I am not saying people cant disagree with me or think my stuff is overpriced, or worthless, BUT you seem to be going down the line......



May want to back off..... Keep in mind all the previous conversations..



Todd Z

 
I never said any of your stuff was overpriced or useless, thats totally untrue.And I have been one of your customers so pls retract that statement.

As far as the IATs, mine run at ambiant at H'way speeds, so did my sons prior to the SC install, must be a calif thing.
 

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