My Poor Trac

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Rocco why is it so hard for you to understand that drivers traveling slow in fast moving traffic is dangerous? I'm not talking about a person driving slow on a side street but someone driving 50 when all the traffic around them is going 65 or 70.

After 26 years of making accidents on Houston freeways I can give you hundreds of examples of why this practice is extremely dangerous.
 
A slow driver can cause an accident if the conditions are right. If a slow driver stays in his lane and maintains his speed and direction, most people can get around with no problem. But I've seen people slow down in the middle or left lane to try to get off a freeway, then change lanes in front of faster traffic to get to the exit. Who is at fault there? If he'd kept up with traffic, his lane change wouldn't have done much to disturb traffic flow. After all, it's not really how fast any one car is going that makes an accident. Instead it is how much difference in speed there is between two cars that makes an accident.
 
Like I said - the slow driver doesn't cause any accidents. He may be the 'reason' the person that does cause the accident did whatever was done to initiate he contact, but the slow driver was not the "cause" - the action of the other driver was the cause. Once again - the reason the original poster made contact with the car in front of him was because that car hit his brakes. But that was not what caused the accident.



Driving slower than the prevailing traffic may be dangerous, but it's the impatience of other's that causes the danger, not driving slow per se. Remember, when all traffic is travelling at legal speeds in the same direction the person initiating the contact is responsible for the accident.



As for dreman's example - what you describe is illegal. You cannot slow down that much to change lanes on a freeway regardless of why you are changing lanes. Also, you cannot come to a full stop on a right of way without an emergency situation be present. Stopping or attempting to merge with faster moving traffic is not legal anywhere I've ever seen. When merging you have to attain the same speed as the vehicles you are trying to merge with AND have a clear space in which to merge.



And neither of those are the same as travelling on the road at a constant legal speed, which even you say is 'no problem in most cases.' The cases where it is a problem it is always due to what the faster drivers attempt to do to get around the slower one.
 
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Just to fuel the fire a tad...



In Texas, when posted "Left lane for Passing only" or "Slower traffic Keep Right", then riding in the fast lane is a class C misdemeanor up to 200 bucks. So, if the guy is doing 20 (there is no minimum, so a legal speed) in the posted passing lane and gets whacked, who's fault is it? Welcome to San Antonio - but beware these particular idiots. They do exist.



grump
 
If they are driving in a lane that is posted as 'passing only' or there are specific laws about slower moving traffic staying to the right and they aren't passing a car doing less than 20 they are violating the law. Who's fault is it if they get whacked? I imaging Texas law might address that.



But I wonder how anyone can justify rearending someone for any reason? I bet in a case like that BOTH drivers are cited.



:)
 
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I agree with TJR 100%. Everyone has an excuse for everything these days and no one wants to be held accountable for their mistakes anymore.



As another "reformed aggresive driver", I agree that it is YOUR fault if you hit someone from behind. You were either following too close, driving too fast, not paying attention, or a combination of the three.



I also think this is usually associated with younger, less-experienced drivers, such as teen-agers. I speak from experience. I wiped clipped a vehicle and totalled out a dodge Ram with my old S-10 when I was 19 while driving from western NC to Ft. Bragg on I-40 once. A light rain had just started falling, traffic was thick, and someone up the road slammed on their brakes, which resulted in everyone else following suit. I failed to notice the stream of brake-lights lighting up in front of me and when I finally saw them, attempted to swerve into the median to miss the car in front of me. I bounced back into them and t-boned the afore mentioned Ram. Fortunately no one was hurt and the owner of the car I clipped agreed to let me pay him off without alerting the cops or insurance agencies. The Ram was a sponsor truck for a pro-bass fisherman, so he didn't give a flip either. I was lucky, but I learned a valuable lesson that day and have never made that mistake again. Even driving in Italy, where you almost have to be an aggresive driver just to get onto the dang highway, I still maintain my distance. Fortunately, most europeans are much better drivers than we Americans (much heavier fines and more expensive to get your license over there) and give much better warning as to their intentions (signals and flashing lights to pass).



Bottom line: If you hit someone from behind, it was because you violated one or more basic driving principles. Regardless of what happens 2 or 3 cars ahead of you, if you obey safe speed vs. distance from the car in front of you, you will not have to worry about this happening. You'll have enough time and space to avoid the damage. I'm glad you survived ok, and regret the loss of your ST. Just take time to reflect on what happened and take steps in the future to ensure you don't fall into the same trap again. Best of luck to you.
 
Hey... as long as your not in front of ME going the 'speed limit' or less in the left lane, we got NO problems! I drive 'european'... meaning that if you're in the left lane and there's cars behind you, GET THE HELL OUTTA THE WAY! And yes, I will tailgate your slow ass, just like the NASCAR nation folks! I could care less what the speed limit is...

I am a VERY aggresive driver, and have had several road rage incidents because of it... I've had rocks thrown at me on the freeway for telling clowns off. I'm sure that one day one of the other Sac ST site members will be posting my obit on here cause some bozo with a gun capped my ass because I told him he needed to look at the driver's manual before getting behind the wheel next time!

And yes, I've thought about a push bar bumper several times for just such an occaision!
 
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Sorry to hear about the Trac boxer....don't worry about the ruckus, it happens no matter what.



It seems no one knows the basic rules of driving anymore, I'm just glad I don't share the immediate road with anyone here, and if I'm abroad, I'll know to watch out for any ST drivers.
 
I see somone in front of me in the left lane of the freeway, no one in front of him or alongside them, and they're doing 65 mph... I'm coming up on them 10 - 15 mph faster, they need to move right. If I need to pass them on the right, which is illegal, I'm pissed that I had to break another law to pass them. That's how I look at it. I drive fast, and I'm quick to move right when someone comes up behind me. At least they're in the passing lane, and not trying to weave through traffic!
 
I agree with you Krash, but only to a point. The left lane, as you and I know, IS the fast lane. Sunday drivers have no place in it. I think the flashing lights work well. It's something I've seen and used a lot in Italy. The problem with this, however, is that many people actually use the left lane as a passing lane, which is what it was for to begin with. Someone may be going 10 or 15 mph over the limit , in the left lane, to get around a slower car in front of him. However, when you roll up doing 30-50 mph over the limit, because you "care less about the limit", it seems like the passing car in front of you is poking along like grandpa, although he's just trying to get around an even slower driver. Plus all the dramatic light flashing and turn-signals in the on position just create more distractions for other drivers.



If you don't have any regard for the posted limits or regulations, so be it. That's your perogative. Likewise, your own safety is your own concern. All I'd ask of you is to ask yourself if you have ever really gotten anywhere much faster than the guy going the speed limit as a result of tail-gating or driving like a mad-man? I never did. I just wasted a lot of gas and brake-pads. Now that i've toned-down my driving a little, I love to watch guys like you race to the next stop-sign or traffic light just so they can wait longer than the rest of us to get there. Of course it's a different situation on a major high-way where you might get a slow driver who backs up traffic for miles. It just creates an unsafe environment for everyone when you tail-gate and honk horns, etc. Some well placed flashing high-beams from a few hundred feet back will accomplish the same affect, usually alerting the "slow" driver to your intentions to move through. NASCAR driving should stay on NASCAR tracks, though. I seriously doubt Dale Earnhart Jr. or Mark Martin drive like they do on the track when they take their personal rides to go to get a carton of milk. Anyone who attempts to do so is jeopardizing his and everyone else's safety aroud him and is just being an @$$hole. Plus there are a lot of "bozos", like me out there, who travel with concealed carry firearms in our cars to protect our families from rest-stop robbers and general riff-raff one faces when they travel.



Try to lighten up. You'll live longer and your insurance will be cheaper.
 
I know the law says if you run into someone from behind then you are held at fault but sometimes the person in front can be at fault also. The one accident I have had in my ST involved rear ending a lady in an explorer. We were both stopped waiting to turn right onto a very busy one way feeder. She started out and then halfway out into the feeder she abruptly stopped. Because my focus was on the fast moving oncoming vehicles I took my eyes off her and started out also, without realizing she had stoped. Ended up bumping her in the rear. Yes I should have been watching her also but she should never have stopped in the middle of the intersection liked she did. (She was on the damn cell phone which I'm sure had a lot to do with her indecision to go or stop. I will be damn glad when they make a law against talking on cell phones while driving.) The damage was minor and no citations were issued.
 
I guess this is something that you have to survive to appreciate fully. Once you get your ride mangled because you were in a hurry, you learn not to do it again. Some people are just slower learners, I guess.



Tom T, I hate to keep making European references, but it is where I've been driving for the last 6 years. Italy handles motor violations on a point basis. Each driver has 30 points (approximately) on their license. In addition to a monetary fine for violations, you also get points reduced from your license. When you reach zero, your license is revoked. For ever. You have to pay, like thousands of Euros and go to special training and an appeals process to even be considered to get your license back. Different violations incure different point deductions. Something like running a red-light or stop sign might cost you 3-5. Speeding might cost you up to 10, depending on how fast. Talking on a cell-phone costs while driving costs you 20, and is second only to driving while intoxicated. It seems to be a good system, and I really wish the US would adopt a similar program.






 
Davy,



I have driven the Autostrada in Northern Italy several times also between Venice & Belluno... I use that mentality here, unfortunately...

I do flash my high beams as I approach from behind. I point to the right lane when they look back in their mirror. I'm talking about the people that ignore you and continue to drive slow in the left lane. And yes, I am familiar with the traffic laws, as I've had to attend traffic school 7 times to have speeding tickets removed from my record. I have all the consideration in the world for other drivers, but 30 years of commuting on Hwy 50 has left me with a bad taste for 'flatliner' drivers... And yes, my name's Krash for a reason.
 
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Scott, I think if you'll re-read my messages a little better, you'll see that I don't feel such behavior (tail-gating) is appropriate. If your last comment wasn't directed at me, then please disregard.
 
I understand about moving out of the passing lane when someone faster is coming up behind you, but quite often, or really almost every time, that person will not wait until I am far enough ahead of the car in the other lane to get over safely, and they get over instead with a few inches clearance and glare at me as they go past.
 
Cool Scott. It looked like you were targeting me for a second, by the way the posts stacked-up, like you said. No harm no foul.



True dreman. Lot's of irresponsible people out there these days. Many of them don't realize the danger they put themselves in by passing within a few inches of a slower moving vehicle. I don't own my ST, YET, but am aware of the false sense of safety one can get from driving an SUV or larger car. People just take there saftey for granted. If everyone had better situation awareness around them, then slower movers would know their is a guy in a hurry behind them and we could hopefully avoid the whole mess.



Well, I think we've beaten this dead horse to death. That new Mustang looks great!!!
 
I don't drive like an idiot at all, just fast. I use my signals 100% of the time, I don't weave through traffic, I don't cut people off... I just want to be able to go fast in the left lane. And some people are clueless... Hence the original post about someone braking in the left lane. After reading all the posts, I spoke my mind. If I come up behind you, flash my lights, point to you go get out of the way, and you're still there, I'm gonna come up on your bumper. Just making a point. That's why I drive at night. The roads are empty!
 
Tom T: I don't know if the cell-phone market in the US has picked-up on the little ear-microphones that you can wear to talk hands free on your phone or not. They look like something from a Star-Trek or Star Wars episode and are just a little plastic "bud" that you slip over your ear, like a pair of sun-glasses. They are all the rage in Europe now. Many people say it makes them more alert because they have both hands on the wheel (so to speak). I disagree, because, aside from making you look like an idiot whose talking to no-one, I fail to see how you can drive and have an active conversation with someone on the phone, regardless of whether you use your hands or not. It has the same affect on most drivers as listening actively to the radio (another distraction), which is to detract your attention from the road and other cars, while you focus on what the invisible person in your head is saying (that sounds weird doesn't it?).



I just don't see what is so hard about pulling over to the shoulder to take a call. People act like it's a matter of life or death if they miss one call. It's ridiculous.
 

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