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JohnnyO, I know what you mean.



I have been in front of a PA Dist Mag. They suck. My #1 issue with speed traps is that they are invariable on some major highway (like the NE extension) and run through some little jerkwater town. They set up their police to "get people", and they are rather dubious at doing it, and it is ALL about making revenue.



My experience is you can't fight it. I had EZ pass time entries on my side to show my average speed, I had witnesses in the car, and but ultimately it was all my word against the cop, who said he followed me for 1 mile and observed my speed at 86mph...one of those was a lie.



TJR
 
My experience is you can't fight it. I had EZ pass time entries on my side to show my average speed, I had witnesses in the car, and but ultimately it was all my word against the cop, who said he followed me for 1 mile and observed my speed at 86mph...one of those was a lie.
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A cop that lies? No way. They are sworn to defend the law.



Speeding tickets are for safety. There is no such thing as a speed trap. If you werent speeding, you would not have been caught.





Tom
 
C'mon Caymen, I am not anti-cop, just anti-that-one-dick. He did lie. He didn't follow me for a mile, and if he had, he would have clocked my speed at more like what it was...5 to 7 over the speed limit, not 21.



Yeah, I was speeding, but there IS such a thing as a speed trap. It's a snare for catching speeders. They caught me, I won't debate that or have issue with it. The dubious nature of his speed trap is that he used manual techniques when there was no need (radar and laser is widely avaiable...why use manual...is it because it allows for a "my word vs his").



The other dubious aspect is that, IMHO, local cops shouldn't even be set up on these highways....the state guys should be doing that. They have much less a financial incentive to find speeders.



Yes, the guy was doing his job. I just question HOW WELL he was doing it, and if it should even be HIS JOB.



TJR
 
C'mon Caymen, I am not anti-cop, just anti-that-one-dick. He did lie. He didn't follow me for a mile, and if he had, he would have clocked my speed at more like what it was...5 to 7 over the speed limit, not 21.
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He was sworn to tell the truth. He would NEVER lie.





Tom
 
TJR,



You are right. All I was doing is giving you a little of your own medicine. That is the way you come across many times.



I, too, have had police officers flat out lie about something I didn't do and they went as far as threatened to arrest me. I have had many run-ins with police and few of them were ever positive.



I have little trust in the police officers. If you are going to lie about 5 MPH over the limit, how can I trust one not to plant evidence?



I am not saying all police officers are bad, but if you get bit by 9 out of 10 dogs, you aren't going to trust the 11th dog not to bite.





Tom
 
Caymen, you were being sarcastic. I am rarely sarcastic. I am inquisitive as I try to understand people's comments, but try never to be sarcastic.



Also, you must be a lightning rod for bad cops...which may say more about you then about them. I've had plenty of dealings with police over the years, all but 1 have been positive.



TJR
 
I agree with TJR ... when you do something to get within the dogs reach and cause them to 'bite' that many times, it makes you wonder why !! Not to say that there aren't any bad cops out there, but sounds like the common denominator to Tom's situations is TOM ... and with that kind of attitude, do you still wonder why ???
 
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Caymen, you were being sarcastic. I am rarely sarcastic. I am inquisitive as I try to understand people's comments, but try never to be sarcastic.
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Did you read my other post? I will quote it again.



You are right. All I was doing is giving you a little of your own medicine. That is the way you come across many times.
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Growing up in the city in a drug infested neighborhood is a little different then visiting to officer at the local donut shop in a small town. That has alot to do with it.



One time I lost control of a trailer I was towing. When the officer showed up, he checked things out, asked me a few questions then we sat in the car. He said to me, I got the call from the truckers that said you did one hell of a job controling the vehicle and preventing yourself or someone else injury. There is no need to give you a citation for failure to control because you controled the vehicle to a safe spot. That was a good officer.



I was one time pulled over at 10:55 PM because I was driving in a bad neighborhood. (I lived in that neighborhood) When the officer was finished with me, he looked at his watch and it was 11:01. I was one block from my house and had PLENTY of time to get hom before city curfew before the officer pulled me over because I was in a bad neighborhood. What would an officer do in that situation?



Give me a citation for breaking city curfew. That is a bad cop and an @$$hole.



I have other situations, but as I said, I am not too trustworthy when it comes to officers. If they will lie about 10 MPH, how can I trust them with anything else?





Tom
 
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We need Q's informative posts. It just isn't the same without him around here. I like those "slap and run" guys. They are tough.





Tom
 
The other dubious aspect is that, IMHO, local cops shouldn't even be set up on these highways....the state guys should be doing that.
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That's one good thing about PA, only the state police are allowed to use radar and laser. Everybody else has to make do with VASCAR, ESP, and speedo clocking.

I live not far from PA's #1 speed trap, Kilbuck Township. Population 723 but the police force numbers about 17 to run the speed trap on Rt. 65. :lol: Or at least it WAS #1 until the new Wal-Mart site slid down the hill and across the road. :blink: Now you can't speed there even if you wanted. It must be killing them.
 
JohnnyO is right about local officers not having the right to use radar or laser. I grew up in western PA and still have property there. I drive through a few little burghs when I go back. One in particular, Brookville on state route 36 in Jefferson County, is particularly bad. They have VASCAR lines all through town and I have watched them pull over many vehicles. The town is very hilly and it is tough to maintain the speed limit when going downhill and they know it. I just refuse to buy my brake pads or gas or anything else in their town. :D
 
Re-verified last night on I-95, in NC just below the VA line :) 97 is where mine kicks and spits and pops. I was rolling behind a BMW 7 series toward VA. I slowed at the border, he didn't, and Emporia PD had him before mile marker 7 pulled over. I waved as I went by ;)



Bottom line, if you're speeding, you're speeding. Get caught and the ticket is acurate, just pay the man. If it's BS, fight it, but be prepared to lose. After all, when you go to court, you must be guilty, cops are superhuman and not subject to corruption and lying :)



Most officers I have ever met were excellent citizens, but there are a few that give them all a black eye. I respect the uniform on everyone of them.
 
Math-you,



Good post! You said explicitly what I guess I meant in a more subtle fashion.



BTW, Caymen, did you ever think that much of your issue with police and authority is the fact that you grew up in a drug invested city?



That sounds like a no-win situation to me. Cops in those types of neighborhoods spend their whole career dealing with a public that distrusts them at best, or hates them at worst, and won't help the cops to help them. You know I am right. Therefore, cops, in that situation, being human, do what most people would do, they return distrust, unkindness and harshness with the same. Not all, but probably most. It's very easy to understand and quite common-sense to expect.



So, if we agree that the above probably defines the human dynamics at play, I ask...who is really at fault here? The police? The residents?



My suburban police are quite pleasant, treat people with respect and give them a break, mostly because they receive that same treatment in kind.



I think this gets back to who do you blame when things don't go your way? You blame yourself (or if a child, those responsible for you).



Do you still live in that neighborhood?



TJR
 
Sounds like she is guilty no matter what. Maybe she was doing only 85? Still she was speeding. She needs to own up-to it and pay the fine.



As far as winning or losing in court trying to fight it? My good friend who is a Grand Am Cup race car driver is always getting tickets in his 350Z. 14 in the last two years. He has won every case in court proving the radar detector was not accurate. But keep in mind he also has paid his lawyer a lot of money to get out of those tickets.
 
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Scootch,





I am not sure it matters in VA either. Once you are 20 over the limit it is reckless driving. Reckless carries a fine and the potential for jail time.



In VA the highest speed limit we have is 65. 33 or 38 over the limit will not get you any sympathy from Judge Dread.

 
Do you still live in that neighborhood?
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No. After getting married, I moved in with her at her house.



My parents still live there.



I don't buy any of those excuses from the police. You have a job to do, just do it! When the neighborhood is a predomitly black neighborhood (I was the only "White Boy" in class from K through 6th grade), a young white kid going home getting pulled over, AFTER being searched for drugs but finding none, getting a ticket for a curfew violation BECAUSE the officer HELD me there until AFTER 11 PM is Bullshit!!!



You know it as well as I do!!! No excuses are needed. He seen my address on my drivers licence. I was not driving in a bad neighborhood that wasn't my own. I was driving home in my own neighborhood only a block from home. The cop was a jerk!





Tom
 
Caymen, I agree the cop was a jerk in that incident. But you didn't weigh in on whether or not you felt it realistic and expected to presume that police that spend a career patrolling and enforcing the laws in neighborhoods where they are hated and mistrusted would in fact have a bad attitude (whether you consider that an excuse or not)?



TJR
 
How did this thread get hijacked from a question about the speed limiter to the police and speeding tickets?? :huh::huh:



...Rich
 

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