Labor Day isn't a day to remember the troops

[Mark K 2]

I wonder why so many people are posting "Remember Our Troops" memes today depicting coffins of dead soldiers. Labor Day has nothing to do with the military unless you consider that US troops attacked and killed protesters during the Pullman Strike of 1894.

 

[Robert Thomas]

Yes, you are correct it is a day where individuals who have a 9 to 5 job can take off and not go to work while getting paid. They can eat and drink all the while having a care free day without ever giving one thought to the meaning of the Holiday. Also, they have the gall to complain of someone mentions the Military on their day.



All of this while brave men and women or our armed forces continue to work 24/7 and don't take a day off. They put their lives on the line and unfortunately some die giving you the chance to have your day.





God Bless our Troops and America

 

[Richard L]

Redfish. :supercool:



...Rich

 

[Rick Kent]

Any day is a good day to appreciate our armed forces.



I am more offended by the support our troops post on Memorial day.....



The American public is astonishingly uninformed.



I like to think that on labor day I can enjoy not working like all of the unemployed, benefit receiving people I support.



God Bless America.

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

I agree with Mark...remember what LABOR Day stands for. Its not a religious or military thing its a worker thing. If you wanna be gung ho...Veteran's day. You wanna be patriotic..Fourth of July. You wanna salute firefighters...9/11. You wanna celebrate Jesus...Christmas. But remember... Labor Day is a holiday due to the organized labor movement and the bloody battles they fought for you and me.



Remember; Thanks to Organized Labor and the Union movement you have....



Weekends

Coffee breaks, Lunch breaks

Paid vacation

F.M.L.A.

Sick leave

Social Security

a Minimum wage

Civil Rights Act/Prohibiting Employer discrimination

the 8 hour workday

Overtime pay

Child labor laws

Occupational Safety and Health Act OSHA

the 40 hour work week

Worker's compensation

Unemployment Insurance

Pensions

Employer healthcare (if you still have not had it taken from you)

Collective bargaining

Holiday pay

Veterans services

Parental (Pregnancy) leave

Age discrimination Act of 1947

Laws ending sweatshop conditions





it goes on an on...





On LABOR Day...sure you can love you some Jesus and the troops...



BUT THANK A UNION MEMBER SON

 

[Robert Thomas]

I have never thanked a union member for being a union member. I doubt that if any union members thanked any of their union representatives on Labor Day.



Neither Mark or Frank bothered to do that in their post. They just chose to attack.



I will thank Military Members everyday I see them.



I am not sorry or apologetic if that offends someone.

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

never was offended red fish...I thanked plenty of Union brothers too and I thanked myself. I enjoyed the paid vacation day with sausage and peppers on da grill and about 10 Old Styles



I did not call any of my pals I served with tho...Ill call them on Veterans Day

 

[Mark K 2]

I only called out a post in which someone assumed Labor Day had something to do with the troops. Unfortunately, Frank has waded in and f*cked it all up.

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

yeah thats the trouble with an open discussion board..people give opinions...

 

[Richard L]

Unions were necessary many years ago when businesses were taking advantage of their workers with sub-standard wages, long hours, no vacations, no health insurance, unsafe work conditions, etc.



However, most of those old issues have been addressed by State and Federal laws and unions are only there to collect Union dues and give the Union bosses some income.



Now that the Unions do not have to fight for those old issues, they want to hold the business owners hostage by demanding higher pay and benefits for overpaid workers who are free to leave if they are not happy. That's exactly why Unions have been such ripe pickings for organized crime



I have only worked one union job as a teenager and I quit within two weeks. Ever since, I have only worked as a Salaried employee and never had a need for a Union.



My opinion is, Nobody is holding a gun to your head to make you stay at a job. If you don't like the pay or benefits of the job, you are free to leave and find another job. You have the laws to protect you, and if you know the laws in your state, the employer cannot intimidate you.



....Rich

 

[Richard L]

Unions were necessary many years ago when businesses were taking advantage of their workers with sub-standard wages, long hours, no vacations, no health insurance, unsafe work conditions, etc.



However, most of those old issues have been addressed by State and Federal laws. Now Unions are only there to collect Union dues and give the Union bosses some income.



Now that the Unions do not have to fight for those old issues, they want to hold the business owners hostage by demanding higher pay and benefits for overpaid workers who are free to leave if they are not happy. That's exactly why Unions have been such ripe pickings for organized crime



I have only worked one union job as a teenager and I quit within two weeks. Ever since, I have only worked as a Salaried employee and never had a need for a Union.



My opinion is, Nobody is holding a gun to your head to make you stay at a job. If you don't like the pay or benefits of the job, you are free to leave and find another job. You have the laws to protect you, and if you know the laws in your state, the employer cannot intimidate you.



....Rich

 

[EddieS'04]

Richard,

I agree with you. Unions have had their day. I was a union member for 33yrs. If I was to do it over I wouldnt join. Texas is a right to work state. Plus I never did like the Idea of wage sharing. As a proccess control instrument tech. My top pay was the same as the operator sitting on a chair at a pump station pushing on/off buttons when told to. It sucked. I had to go to a community college. On my own time for certification of theory. I actually learned more hands on. I had to be able to run the unit reaction. As so I could determine proccess condition or control issue.

The pump man just got OJT only. Sometimes he would turn on the wrong pump or have a valve blocked. But I would get the call about a flow problem.



Right after I retired. My union "Paper and allied chemical and enrgy workers" PACE. They jioned up with the steel workers. The dues' tripled. Acording to guys' that are still at the plant. they lost contracted benifits. That took years to negotiate. Their representation went to Hell............



Seemed like socialism. No extra $$$ for tech knowledge. Sometimes I would have to educate new engineers.......All I can really say is that the 25yrs as a tech. Was an enjoyable craft. Didnt put any more $$ in my pocket like the non union plants around me. It was hard to give up the senoirity. Also I didnt have to worry about fires or explosions. Or I would have moved on.

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Amazing..."Unions have had their day" "Unions aren't necessary" "Old issues"



Those who forget the (not so recent) past are doomed to repeat it.



If you think working people (99%) can blindly trust corporations and employers to always "do the right thing" you have to have the mental capacity of a chimpanzee. Or you are part of the 23 percent of the voting public that vote a straight GOP ticket no matter if you have an actual chimp running for that office.



America needs checks and balances. Unions are just that. A check. Unions touch on Socialist policy sure. That I cant argue. But the alternative is a race to the bottom and the old days of Rockefeller/Carnegie/Vanderbilt/Morgan/...and they really were kind to their workforces right? Wake the up.



Since the time of the pyramids the craftsmen have been middle class. There was the Pharaoh, the slaves (99%) and a small group of Craft Masons who knew how to cut the stones. They had the Pharaoh by the balls cause they stuck together and held the secrets. (Those damn Socialists!) The truth of the matter Craftsmen are businessmen. They got off their asses, learned a trade by paying dues for 5 years during a tough apprenticeship and stick together to get their fair market value by leveraging others who want to make money too. You want a building built that doesn't fall over? Gotta go through the Union. Tough sh*t. That's business. That's capitalism actually.



You see if you are anti-Union or believe in pure Capitalism with no regulation you are a corporate brainwashed pig and are part of what is wrong with America.



Truth (as uncomfortable as it may be to your LEARNED values)

 

[Richard L]

Frank,

The majority of today's workers do not belong to unions. The craftsmen that you refer to do not need unions...they make it on their skills alone! Much of the manufacturing jobs have moved to China because of cheaper labor costs...much of which is caused by the Unions who demand more money and benefits for their workers without any increase in skill or productivity. The UAW are not craftsmen...they are mostly jobs that could be better done by robots. UAW members are trained to do one or two mindless tasks that anyone can do and the Union fights to prevent or limit the use of robots that can do the same job better, faster, cheaper and do not require breaks, vacations, healthcare, or go on strike. And more importantly, they don't need Unions !



Most employers follow the rules and laws regarding employees, and the few that don't eventually pay a heavy prices. You don't have to blindly think the corporations or employers will "Do the right thing". If they don't you simply leave and go to work for someone else. Why is that such an issue for you that you need a Union. You can always sue them, or sic the State's Labor commission on them. Laws have replaced the need for Unions.



...Rich

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

"Most employers follow the rules" lol - Sweatshops



"Laws have replaced the need for Unions" LOL-Who forced the Govt. to pass these laws?



"Better done by robots" My question.. Who fixes the robots?



"Ignorance is strength"...George Orwell...

 

[Richard L]

Frank.

"Most employers follow the rules" lol - Sweatshops

So, where are all these sweat shops in the USA? The few that might exists are using illegal aliens for there cheap unskilled labor, and they are free to leave.

"Laws have replaced the need for Unions" LOL-Who forced the Govt. to pass these laws?

Mostly from Unions a long time ago... Like I said, Laws have replaced the Unions.

"Better done by robots" My question.. Who fixes the robots?[

Robots are repaired by well paid, talented and SKILLED technicians who don't need a Union.

"Ignorance is strength"...George Orwell...

If that were true, I would expect you to be much smarter !

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

"Laws have replaced the Unions"



From The Times of Northwest Indiana: (Our local paper just yesterday)







The death of unions turns out to be greatly exaggerated, at least in Indiana.



Union membership has surged in the past two years in Indiana since the passage of a right-to-work law in 2012, confounding expectations of many.



Indiana had 299,000 union members last year, up from 249,000 union members in 2013, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Union membership, which dipped as low as 9.1 percent of the workforce in 2012, was back to 10.7 percent of the workforce in 2014.



And the number of Indiana workers who are represented by unions in their workplace, but not necessarily dues-paying members, rose to 335,000 last year, which is 12 percent of the total workforce.



The false rhetoric is that unions are dying is untrue. Unions ? which represented a quarter of all American workers as recently as 1980 and much higher percentages during the 1950's, (the greatest era of prosperity and middle class upward mobility) are indeed not finished ? Northwest Indiana and much of the state remain bastions of the labor movement.



Storefronts along 119th Street in downtown Whiting were filled with signs supporting the striking United Steelworkers earlier this year when BP refinery workers hit the picket lines. Thousands of union members from many crafts have turned up to recent rallies outside the steel mills in East Chicago, downtown Gary and Burns Harbor. As steel contract talks have dragged on, Steelworkers have maintained solidarity to defend health care benefits even after the import-battered steel companies handed out thousands of pink slips nationwide.



A recent Gallup poll found 58 percent of Americans support unions, a dramatic increase of five percentage points over the 2007 level, when unions only enjoyed support from 53 percent of the public. And Indiana's "right-to-work" legislation, which unions characterized as "right to work for less," has failed to put a dent in union membership since it was passed in 2012.



The state's right-to-work law prohibits union security agreements that make paying union dues a condition of employment. Unions say it was a union-busting move meant to harm them financially.



However, union membership skyrocketed in Indiana by nearly 18 percent between 2012 and 2014.



Read the full article from The Times of Northwest Indiana.



Richard you may be watching the wrong media network son. Turn the channel and you may bet some information that has a little truth in it. Your ignorance is our strength...

 

[Richard L]

Frank,

you may be watching the wrong media network son. Turn the channel and you may bet some information that has a little truth in it.

So you assume that only the channels that YOU watch are telling you the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth???



If you actually read the article you posted it clearly states that the "Right to work" law in Indiana would prevent unions from collecting union dues.... but if they allow collective bargaining, the union could still collect a "Fee". This is the same fight that went on in Wisconsin a few years ago.



I don't doubt the existence of Unions, and if you believe the polls, perhaps their membership has grown. but in Wisconsin it declined sharply...so who's propaganda are we to believe.



My contention has always been, if you have skills and education, you don't need a union to protect you from labor abuse from unscrupulous employers. I still stand by my statement that Laws have replaced the need for unions... Unions have replaced the robber barons and railroad barons of 100 years ago. Unions are destroying industry in America and have way too much influence on on American politics. They are just another Special interest group that panders to Democratic candidates. Anyone who is pro-union will never agree with that, and that's why they join unions and vote for Democrates.



Texas is a Right to Work state and there are unions here. In almost all cases the unions represent workers who are performing unskilled, jobs. These are jobs that any able bodied person can do with a few minutes or a few hours of training and some practice. The employer can easily hire replacement workers. Again, something that can probably be done cheaper, better, faster by a robots. That has been what has been driving so many jobs to China, especially manufacturing jobs.



BTW You still have not answered my questions "Where are all these Sweat Shops you claim the unions are protecting us from".



Again, your ignorance speaks volumes about you. Don't you think it's odd that nobody on this website agrees with you on anything? It appears that you only come here to have someone to agrue with.