FlipTrac_511
Well-Known Member
Nicely said, Joseymack.
Illegal Immigrants. Your opinion.
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farout squarecat
Member
"illegal" is the key word. End of discussion.
Jeffrey Travis
Well-Known Member
I say we make it an even trade, we keep the illegals and send them all our Lawyers. Who has a greater impact for the good of society, I mean both groups cost the average citizen but in different ways (not paying taxes/riding the system vs frivolous lawsuits)?
In the immortal words of Triumph the Insult Comic Dog, "I kid, I kid."
None the less, that should spark a few responses.
JT#14
In the immortal words of Triumph the Insult Comic Dog, "I kid, I kid."
None the less, that should spark a few responses.
JT#14
Q,
Prove your statements. Show us how smart you are. You do nothing to contribute here. I can't wait until you grow up and leave.
Really sad coming from a fellow RVer. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk.
Tom
Prove your statements. Show us how smart you are. You do nothing to contribute here. I can't wait until you grow up and leave.
Really sad coming from a fellow RVer. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk.
Tom
An ignorant mind is even worse. Sorry to hear about your problem. I guess it sucks to be you.
Tom
Tom
Johnny O
Well-Known Member
Caymen said:
K-Mart effed up enough on their own without Wal-Mart's help. I used to work for them, I know.
Anyhow....
I'm puzzled why the illegals want to turn the southwest U.S. into Mexico, when if it wasn't so bad they wouldn't be leaving in droves in the first place. Or do they want a Mexico with U.S. laws and economy, rights, etc.? Then stay and make a better Mexico.
I think for now ol' Vincente is happy about lots of people leaving and sending money back but I think largely they are losing the best and brightest and in the long-term Mexico will end up a nation of 'tards riding the short bus with just a handful of people running the joint.
Jose Santana
Active Member
Q are you really this dumb?
Yea i pay out of my arse in taxes... Maybe more should be kept at home instead of in Iraq...I think there is also some Federal level of funding for schools and I know there is State level funding.... It's all Americans responsibility to see our children have a good education. And if the Federal government is not involved in educating our youth then tell the president to shut the F up with the "no child left behind" crap since there is nothing they can do.
And being a border patrol agent makes you what? More knowledgeable on reading the minds of these illegals... I bet you never once gave 2 rats arses about anything these people had to say, as long as you could catch them and send them back. Hey that's fine though it's the job you have to do... But I would even go further and say you are one of those "SHERIFF" type yahoos with a six shooter and a wad of tobacco in your mouth and you just dispise those ilegals... Probably got your rocks off everytime you grabbed one.. What a rush!
Safer world????? At least you got the balls to say what the real motive is - OIL.... So what is it, make the world safe or safeguard "our" oil?
Your brilliance proceeds you...What the hell does this mean?
Fer Echegaray
Well-Known Member
Amen joseymack,
I remember not long ago someone posted a comment that the constitution provides for keeping teh citizens safe, not for educating them...
So I guess a safe burger flipper is better than an educated-enough-to-find-the-bs-in-govmt-talk unsafe proffessional....
I remember not long ago someone posted a comment that the constitution provides for keeping teh citizens safe, not for educating them...
So I guess a safe burger flipper is better than an educated-enough-to-find-the-bs-in-govmt-talk unsafe proffessional....
Jose Santana
Active Member
Ahhhhhh attaboy Q... I was hoping to get a good laugh from you before i went home... Q you sound like your about 28 years old and full of tidbits and non-facts....
So since you see illegals crossing the boarder and you catch them makes you an expert on thier thoughts of America..
My Community is a city of about 180K people... I think- you want to say it is full of minorities and that is why it is this way,.. but it isn't..... It is this way for a variety of reasons cutbacks, budgets, unions, corruption...you name it... All i know is I have a 16year old who does not have a book to bring home because of the shortage of books, his classes have 35 plus students and i don;t make enough to send him to private school... Blame me if you want, i go to the meetings and I vote. I think the federal gov should be prioritizing this and keep some money here! Stop the corporate breaks and do something for our own people....
So since you see illegals crossing the boarder and you catch them makes you an expert on thier thoughts of America..
My Community is a city of about 180K people... I think- you want to say it is full of minorities and that is why it is this way,.. but it isn't..... It is this way for a variety of reasons cutbacks, budgets, unions, corruption...you name it... All i know is I have a 16year old who does not have a book to bring home because of the shortage of books, his classes have 35 plus students and i don;t make enough to send him to private school... Blame me if you want, i go to the meetings and I vote. I think the federal gov should be prioritizing this and keep some money here! Stop the corporate breaks and do something for our own people....
John Turner 3
Member
Q said:
Those statements show ignorance of the highest order. Enforcing a law or rule as a soldier or agent is a far, far cry from designing and implementing an effective security policy. That's why some people make great soldiers and agents, but lousy generals and directors.
Fact: we invaded a sovereign country with no proven link whatsoever to 9/11. We invaded Iraq and Afghanistan because 1) they are weak, 2) the general public is incapable of thinking critically and seeing the big picture (as evidenced by your comments above), and 3) Bush saw an opportunity to grab a higher approval rating in preparation for his reelection.
Fact: we have spent $250 billion (or more) for ZERO demonstrable results. Indeed, you can easily argue that the mid-east region is MORE unstable now than it was. All that has been done is we've lost a couple thousand American citizens, killed thousands of civilians in addition to some "insurgents" (whatever that means), and ruined our reputation and foreign policy standing for decades into the future. Yeah, that sure was a smart thing to do. How will you feel when the American military body count in Iraq and Afghanistan reaches higher than the number of people lost on 9/11?
Fact: more and more oil producing countries are nationalizing their reserves and REFUSING to allow private companies (ESPECIALLY American private companies) access to those reserves. The May 15 issue of BusinessWeek has a nice article on this, you should read it and (hopefully) comprehend it before spouting off. In the 1960s, 85% of the known global oil reserves were fully open to the big oil companies. Now? Its 16%. In 1979, US and British oil companies accounted almost 28% of global oil production. Now? 14%. Nationalised oil companies in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and Mexico have WAY more production than ExxonMobil, the largest private (non-government) oil company. People hear about ExxonMobil in the news and they think it is some giant beast of a company when in fact there are other companies that are bigger. If invading countries to "stabilize" them (this is a euphemism for "we demand cheap oil") is such good policy, what are we going to do? Invade all of them? Invade Mexico? You can't be serious. LOL
Iraq is a "good base of operations against Iran"? Are you kidding? If Iraq is so easy, why are Americans still dying over there? The worst strategic mistake would be thinking Iraq was "stable" and then trying to fight a war in another country using it as a base. Even teenage computer wargamers would be able to figure that out.
Q said:
Again, this show just a fundamental lack of understanding. Think about it: if Americans didn't pay so much to the federal government in taxes to fund your invasion to make things "safe", wouldn't they have more money to spend at home on the things that REALLY make a difference? Like housing, healthcare, food, and a college education or other skilled training? Why should we pay the federal government only to have them pay us back less and give us nothing in return? Why not just cut out the middl
Those statements show ignorance of the highest order. Enforcing a law or rule as a soldier or agent is a far, far cry from designing and implementing an effective security policy. That's why some people make great soldiers and agents, but lousy generals and directors.
Fact: we invaded a sovereign country with no proven link whatsoever to 9/11. We invaded Iraq and Afghanistan because 1) they are weak, 2) the general public is incapable of thinking critically and seeing the big picture (as evidenced by your comments above), and 3) Bush saw an opportunity to grab a higher approval rating in preparation for his reelection.
Fact: we have spent $250 billion (or more) for ZERO demonstrable results. Indeed, you can easily argue that the mid-east region is MORE unstable now than it was. All that has been done is we've lost a couple thousand American citizens, killed thousands of civilians in addition to some "insurgents" (whatever that means), and ruined our reputation and foreign policy standing for decades into the future. Yeah, that sure was a smart thing to do. How will you feel when the American military body count in Iraq and Afghanistan reaches higher than the number of people lost on 9/11?
Fact: more and more oil producing countries are nationalizing their reserves and REFUSING to allow private companies (ESPECIALLY American private companies) access to those reserves. The May 15 issue of BusinessWeek has a nice article on this, you should read it and (hopefully) comprehend it before spouting off. In the 1960s, 85% of the known global oil reserves were fully open to the big oil companies. Now? Its 16%. In 1979, US and British oil companies accounted almost 28% of global oil production. Now? 14%. Nationalised oil companies in Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, and Mexico have WAY more production than ExxonMobil, the largest private (non-government) oil company. People hear about ExxonMobil in the news and they think it is some giant beast of a company when in fact there are other companies that are bigger. If invading countries to "stabilize" them (this is a euphemism for "we demand cheap oil") is such good policy, what are we going to do? Invade all of them? Invade Mexico? You can't be serious. LOL
Iraq is a "good base of operations against Iran"? Are you kidding? If Iraq is so easy, why are Americans still dying over there? The worst strategic mistake would be thinking Iraq was "stable" and then trying to fight a war in another country using it as a base. Even teenage computer wargamers would be able to figure that out.
Q said:
Again, this show just a fundamental lack of understanding. Think about it: if Americans didn't pay so much to the federal government in taxes to fund your invasion to make things "safe", wouldn't they have more money to spend at home on the things that REALLY make a difference? Like housing, healthcare, food, and a college education or other skilled training? Why should we pay the federal government only to have them pay us back less and give us nothing in return? Why not just cut out the middl
Mark Grumpy
Well-Known Member
You are absolutely right. They would all be national because we'd be the ones getting blown up.
The best defense is.... anyone? A good offense. The ONLY reason this country has the freedoms it has is fear of retaliation. Been this way for a long time now, circa Enola Gay.
THAT is why we are over there. Good grief, do you protest at the funerals of our soldiers??
grump
John Turner 3
Member
grump said:
That is an asinine comment. I respect everyone in military service, my father is a retired tanker (2nd Armored).
I am not against military service, I am against spending BILLIONS of dollars to invade another country for NO reason, with NO plan, and with NO chance of changing anything or making anything better, when that money could be used right here at home to correct our own problems. Saudi Arabia had more to do with 9/11 than Iraq, but you don't see us invading them, do you?
Saddam Hussein was a bad guy? We made him!!! We gave him money for YEARS, he was our ally!!! He only became the "enemy" when he stopped doing what our government told him to do. Then we invade, and thousands of Americans die. For NO GOOD reason.
We made things worse invading Iraq and Afghanistan, not better. If you think things are better and safer now than they were in 2000, you haven't been reading the newspapers or watching the news.
Basically, you're saying it is perfectly OK for you to invade your neighbor's house, point a gun at him, and demand that he run his family the way you want it run, and if he doesn't do it, or resists, you get to kill him and anyone in your way without consequences. That's what you're saying it is OK to do, because that's what the US has done and continues to do.
The US does not have the right to tell other countries what to do. We are not the world's police force, and shouldn't be. We should be spending our efforts and money on fixing the problems that exist right here at home, like almost 50 million citizens without health insurance. More prison population per capita than any other industrialized nation, and getting worse! More than double the healthcare cost per capita of any other industrialized nation, and getting worse!
It boggles my mind that you can look at how out of whack things are right here at home and believe that things are getting better or will be better if we run over to the other side of the world and kill people instead of fixing the things that are wrong right here.
That is an asinine comment. I respect everyone in military service, my father is a retired tanker (2nd Armored).
I am not against military service, I am against spending BILLIONS of dollars to invade another country for NO reason, with NO plan, and with NO chance of changing anything or making anything better, when that money could be used right here at home to correct our own problems. Saudi Arabia had more to do with 9/11 than Iraq, but you don't see us invading them, do you?
Saddam Hussein was a bad guy? We made him!!! We gave him money for YEARS, he was our ally!!! He only became the "enemy" when he stopped doing what our government told him to do. Then we invade, and thousands of Americans die. For NO GOOD reason.
We made things worse invading Iraq and Afghanistan, not better. If you think things are better and safer now than they were in 2000, you haven't been reading the newspapers or watching the news.
Basically, you're saying it is perfectly OK for you to invade your neighbor's house, point a gun at him, and demand that he run his family the way you want it run, and if he doesn't do it, or resists, you get to kill him and anyone in your way without consequences. That's what you're saying it is OK to do, because that's what the US has done and continues to do.
The US does not have the right to tell other countries what to do. We are not the world's police force, and shouldn't be. We should be spending our efforts and money on fixing the problems that exist right here at home, like almost 50 million citizens without health insurance. More prison population per capita than any other industrialized nation, and getting worse! More than double the healthcare cost per capita of any other industrialized nation, and getting worse!
It boggles my mind that you can look at how out of whack things are right here at home and believe that things are getting better or will be better if we run over to the other side of the world and kill people instead of fixing the things that are wrong right here.
Come on Q. Reply back. I like to hear your comments. Better then Comedy Central.
Tom
Tom
Nelson Atwell
Well-Known Member
Star Trek fans are familiar with the "Prime Directive". I wonder if something like that would work in real life?
edit -- as far as the illegal immigrants -- get used to them. There is no way we could ever get rid of them. We may as well make the best of it, and grant them asylum. We can then work to get them to start paying taxes. The IRS already has to chase down Americans, so they have a real challenge.
edit -- as far as the illegal immigrants -- get used to them. There is no way we could ever get rid of them. We may as well make the best of it, and grant them asylum. We can then work to get them to start paying taxes. The IRS already has to chase down Americans, so they have a real challenge.
Last edited by a moderator:
shawn stonbraker 2
Well-Known Member
Boy, when I started this thread I wasn't expecting for it to get so far off track. Both sides of the arguement make some good points but WOW, some of the comments are really wild.
First off the one of the key words is ILLEGAL. If you are here illegally then I think you don't need to be here. You come here to try to make a better life for yourself and/or your family. No problem. Then do it the legal way. That is just my opinion and the way I feel about it. I can't help it that it may take years to do it. All I ask is to do it the right way and put back into the country that is helping you make a better life. Don't come here and thry to make this country "remind" you of your home country. If your home country was so great then why are you here?
Second key words are "your opinion". I didn't ask for facts. I asked everyone thier opinion. As the saying goes, "opinions are like a**holes, Everyone has one". You may not like my opinion but it's just what it is. An opinion.
Anyway, here is another "opinion" of mine. John, if you think we invaded another country "for no reason" I have to disagree with you. I think there was a reason. Just because Saddam was "made" by us, doesn't mean that we thought he was a "good guy". He was just the "lesser of two evils". We backed him because Iran was invading them (and getting support from the then horrible Russia). Then "when Saddam quit listening to the US" and invaded Kuwiat, we went over to get him out. (which I was a part of) I have no problem with what we are doing or have done over there. I support our troops 100%. I also know that they "volunteered" for the duty they are performing. They know that if they go into the forces, there is a chance they could die. I commend them for that. I knew that going in, and I joined up when there wasn't anything even going on (1989). Almost a year to the day I went in, I'm sitting in Saudi Arabia waiting to go into Iraq. How can you say we haven't changed anything over there? These people were being dictated over and living in fear of being killed by some idiot for no reason at all. The ones causing problems now are the a**holes that aren't even from there. Is al-Zarqawi Iraqi? No, he was born in Jordan. Is Osama Iraqi or Afganni? No, he's Saudi. If you think that being Arab is all the same over there you're wrong. Those countries over there are like the US, Canada, and Mexico over here. They are just taking advantage of an oppertunity to cause problems for the US. They want everyone to hate us over there. Why do they hate us so bad? You tell me. Maybe, it could be we do stick our noses into everyone's business. I agree that we do get into things we need to just stay out of. I do feel that if these guys do what they did on 9/11 and you are going to hid them and give them support, then you should be willing to suffure the consecuences when we retaliate. We need to send a message that if you support these idiots, then we will hold you responsible when they do what they do. May be harsh, may not be right in your eyes, but seems fair to me. As for Iraq, we made the mess it's our responsability to clean it up. Guess what, people will die and keep dying over there. Nothing we can do about it. If we pull out now, some jerk-off will come in and take over. Am I saying that years down the road, if and when we do pull out, that somebody won't do that? No. That area over there has been a hotspot for a long time. The terrorists have alway done thier work over there. They have always had "car bombs", "suicide bombers", and the like for as long as I can remember.How can we expect to change that? We can't.
The US has always been the one that everyone came to for help. Why is it now that when we need help, nobody is willing to come to our aide? Because we are the "Big, Bad, US" and we can do anything we want. Maybe we should just stick our heads in the sand and ignore everything that goes on everywhere else and th
First off the one of the key words is ILLEGAL. If you are here illegally then I think you don't need to be here. You come here to try to make a better life for yourself and/or your family. No problem. Then do it the legal way. That is just my opinion and the way I feel about it. I can't help it that it may take years to do it. All I ask is to do it the right way and put back into the country that is helping you make a better life. Don't come here and thry to make this country "remind" you of your home country. If your home country was so great then why are you here?
Second key words are "your opinion". I didn't ask for facts. I asked everyone thier opinion. As the saying goes, "opinions are like a**holes, Everyone has one". You may not like my opinion but it's just what it is. An opinion.
Anyway, here is another "opinion" of mine. John, if you think we invaded another country "for no reason" I have to disagree with you. I think there was a reason. Just because Saddam was "made" by us, doesn't mean that we thought he was a "good guy". He was just the "lesser of two evils". We backed him because Iran was invading them (and getting support from the then horrible Russia). Then "when Saddam quit listening to the US" and invaded Kuwiat, we went over to get him out. (which I was a part of) I have no problem with what we are doing or have done over there. I support our troops 100%. I also know that they "volunteered" for the duty they are performing. They know that if they go into the forces, there is a chance they could die. I commend them for that. I knew that going in, and I joined up when there wasn't anything even going on (1989). Almost a year to the day I went in, I'm sitting in Saudi Arabia waiting to go into Iraq. How can you say we haven't changed anything over there? These people were being dictated over and living in fear of being killed by some idiot for no reason at all. The ones causing problems now are the a**holes that aren't even from there. Is al-Zarqawi Iraqi? No, he was born in Jordan. Is Osama Iraqi or Afganni? No, he's Saudi. If you think that being Arab is all the same over there you're wrong. Those countries over there are like the US, Canada, and Mexico over here. They are just taking advantage of an oppertunity to cause problems for the US. They want everyone to hate us over there. Why do they hate us so bad? You tell me. Maybe, it could be we do stick our noses into everyone's business. I agree that we do get into things we need to just stay out of. I do feel that if these guys do what they did on 9/11 and you are going to hid them and give them support, then you should be willing to suffure the consecuences when we retaliate. We need to send a message that if you support these idiots, then we will hold you responsible when they do what they do. May be harsh, may not be right in your eyes, but seems fair to me. As for Iraq, we made the mess it's our responsability to clean it up. Guess what, people will die and keep dying over there. Nothing we can do about it. If we pull out now, some jerk-off will come in and take over. Am I saying that years down the road, if and when we do pull out, that somebody won't do that? No. That area over there has been a hotspot for a long time. The terrorists have alway done thier work over there. They have always had "car bombs", "suicide bombers", and the like for as long as I can remember.How can we expect to change that? We can't.
The US has always been the one that everyone came to for help. Why is it now that when we need help, nobody is willing to come to our aide? Because we are the "Big, Bad, US" and we can do anything we want. Maybe we should just stick our heads in the sand and ignore everything that goes on everywhere else and th
Jeff C
Well-Known Member
For once.................I agree with Q.
mookie
Well-Known Member
:blink::huh:
I agree with Q's last post.:blink:
I agree with Q's last post.:blink:
Nelson Atwell
Well-Known Member
I also agree with Q on this point. I know there was a plan. It may have been developed hastily and with bad intelligence, but almost all contingency plans are developed quickly and without omniscience.
As far as there being a reason -- that is a matter of opinion. The President has sworn an oath to defend and protect the Constitution. He didn't swear to protect you, me, our way of life, provide an education to our kids, put food on our tables or anything else. The Constitution is supposed to protect us, and The Commander-In-Chief and the military protect it. If it is the opinion of the President and Congress that the Constitution is threatened by the actions of another, then they make the decision to go to War. In this case, OUR opinons do not count, because we do not have a role in that decision. We only decide who makes the decision on our behalf. Think about that one when you cast your next ballot.
Congress did decide to go to War, and the President and the US military implemented a war in support of that decision. The War has changed Iraq. We can debate whether the change has made things better or worse, but it is definitely changed. We removed a dictator that attacked and threatened his neighbors and killed his own citizens with chemical weapons. Perhaps a strong leader was needed in Iraq to keep the people from anarchy. Perhaps the insurgents currently causing havok are there simply to drive out the US. We could drop a few neutron bombs on the place and wipe out everyone and then pump out all the oil we want in the region,, if we wanted, but our government respects human life and international law. History will decide whether the decision to go to War was good or bad, but it was decided and we must accept that.
If the United Nations weren't so impotent and indecisive an organization, they could rightly enforce their role as the World's policeman. As it is, the organization is crippled by incompetance and corruption to the highest levels. Lacking any global leadership from them, The US is the only country with enough military might to police the World. It is also the only organization large enough to provide immediate humanitarian relief to an area of devastation like we saw after the Indian Ocean Tsunami and Hurricane Katrina.
If the military were allowed to seal the borders of this country, it would be successful in that as well. Even a rat wouldn't enter the country without us knowing about it. This is proven in the DMZ between North and South Korea. However, the active duty military has no jurisdiction in the US to enforce laws. The National Guard can be called up by the State Governors for this purpose in an emergency, but not the Active Duty.
Don't underestimate the intelligence and wisdom of the folks running this country. On the average, they have more education and higher IQs than any of us. We can sit back and be "armchair quarterbacks" and question their every decision, but what is the usefulness of that?
If you take no action on your complaints, then you are just whining. I respect the Immigrants of this country, because they are not simply whining. They are taking peaceful action by protesting in the streets in great numbers. I have not read of any violence at all. If 500,000 Americans marched, I doubt the same would be said of that. I remember Vietnam protests, and there was violence even when the gatherings were smaller.
As far as there being a reason -- that is a matter of opinion. The President has sworn an oath to defend and protect the Constitution. He didn't swear to protect you, me, our way of life, provide an education to our kids, put food on our tables or anything else. The Constitution is supposed to protect us, and The Commander-In-Chief and the military protect it. If it is the opinion of the President and Congress that the Constitution is threatened by the actions of another, then they make the decision to go to War. In this case, OUR opinons do not count, because we do not have a role in that decision. We only decide who makes the decision on our behalf. Think about that one when you cast your next ballot.
Congress did decide to go to War, and the President and the US military implemented a war in support of that decision. The War has changed Iraq. We can debate whether the change has made things better or worse, but it is definitely changed. We removed a dictator that attacked and threatened his neighbors and killed his own citizens with chemical weapons. Perhaps a strong leader was needed in Iraq to keep the people from anarchy. Perhaps the insurgents currently causing havok are there simply to drive out the US. We could drop a few neutron bombs on the place and wipe out everyone and then pump out all the oil we want in the region,, if we wanted, but our government respects human life and international law. History will decide whether the decision to go to War was good or bad, but it was decided and we must accept that.
If the United Nations weren't so impotent and indecisive an organization, they could rightly enforce their role as the World's policeman. As it is, the organization is crippled by incompetance and corruption to the highest levels. Lacking any global leadership from them, The US is the only country with enough military might to police the World. It is also the only organization large enough to provide immediate humanitarian relief to an area of devastation like we saw after the Indian Ocean Tsunami and Hurricane Katrina.
If the military were allowed to seal the borders of this country, it would be successful in that as well. Even a rat wouldn't enter the country without us knowing about it. This is proven in the DMZ between North and South Korea. However, the active duty military has no jurisdiction in the US to enforce laws. The National Guard can be called up by the State Governors for this purpose in an emergency, but not the Active Duty.
Don't underestimate the intelligence and wisdom of the folks running this country. On the average, they have more education and higher IQs than any of us. We can sit back and be "armchair quarterbacks" and question their every decision, but what is the usefulness of that?
If you take no action on your complaints, then you are just whining. I respect the Immigrants of this country, because they are not simply whining. They are taking peaceful action by protesting in the streets in great numbers. I have not read of any violence at all. If 500,000 Americans marched, I doubt the same would be said of that. I remember Vietnam protests, and there was violence even when the gatherings were smaller.
Jeffrey Travis
Well-Known Member
Not sure if this was brought up yet in this thread but........
http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/mexicoflag.asp
Disgusting. The little bastards want to be on our soil, enjoy our gov't benefits but cannot respect the flag. Talk about biting the hand that feeds you.
Write a letter? If that is the punishment it better be in perfect English.
I say send him back, that's punishment that sends a message to the rest. Most likely though he is a natural citizen because his mother, who was probably here illegally, got knocked up and pushed him out on our soil so she could hang around for 18 more years.
It would take a HUGE change in our constitution but you should NOT be considered a citizen if the 'mother ship' that is carrying you is here illegally. Yea, Yea, at some point many of our ancestors were 'illegals' but they were here 'settling a new land' - I think things have changed a bit since then and yes, our original laws & the constitution have held up over the years but need some tweaking for the good of those that are already here. Isn't it bad enough we have to fund our own deadbeats that ride the system?
Word on the street and around the water cooler is that Mexico is pretty difficult if you want to live there and/or become a citizen.
JT#14
http://www.snopes.com/photos/politics/mexicoflag.asp
Disgusting. The little bastards want to be on our soil, enjoy our gov't benefits but cannot respect the flag. Talk about biting the hand that feeds you.
Write a letter? If that is the punishment it better be in perfect English.
I say send him back, that's punishment that sends a message to the rest. Most likely though he is a natural citizen because his mother, who was probably here illegally, got knocked up and pushed him out on our soil so she could hang around for 18 more years.
It would take a HUGE change in our constitution but you should NOT be considered a citizen if the 'mother ship' that is carrying you is here illegally. Yea, Yea, at some point many of our ancestors were 'illegals' but they were here 'settling a new land' - I think things have changed a bit since then and yes, our original laws & the constitution have held up over the years but need some tweaking for the good of those that are already here. Isn't it bad enough we have to fund our own deadbeats that ride the system?
Word on the street and around the water cooler is that Mexico is pretty difficult if you want to live there and/or become a citizen.
JT#14
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
Read the link below, then continue with this post:
I see a lot of villifying of the "illegal immigrant" here, yet our government allows the illegals, actually coddles them by looking the other way at their employers; lax border security, etc.....actions speak louder than words.
A majority of the illegals want to work, want to keep their noses clean, want to not make waves, and they give back more than they take (or you can be sure our govt would get rid of them, right?).
What's the answer folks? Forget about the few KNOBS that protest, and make jerks of themselves for a second.
How of you are saying "send them back" because you frankly feel these people:
a. don't deserve to get for free what "I" work for
b. they broke the laws and the rules, so why "reward" them
c. they are a burden on me as a taxpayer
Now, for all those that use those as a rational, I again ask for each of the points:
a. don't deserve to get for free what "I" work for
Q: So you ENVY them?; do you want to trade places with them?; does their getting something that you don't get for free somehow take away from your good fortune (that's the scarcity principle...look it up)?
b. they broke the laws and the rules
Q: Is a law that is not enforced really a law? Some here have said that laws should help the people, are we sure enforcing this law would HELP more than it would hurt?
c. they are a burden on me as a taxpayer
Q: Can anyone quantify that burden, in real dollars, in percentage of taxes paid by the average family? Do that, and we can talk...often I think it's the depressed states and the states with high costs of living that use the "illegals" as a scapegoat for their other problems. People like to complain about causes when times are bad.
Like I said, read the link, be a little introspective, tone down the emotion, then let's talk....
TJR
I see a lot of villifying of the "illegal immigrant" here, yet our government allows the illegals, actually coddles them by looking the other way at their employers; lax border security, etc.....actions speak louder than words.
A majority of the illegals want to work, want to keep their noses clean, want to not make waves, and they give back more than they take (or you can be sure our govt would get rid of them, right?).
What's the answer folks? Forget about the few KNOBS that protest, and make jerks of themselves for a second.
How of you are saying "send them back" because you frankly feel these people:
a. don't deserve to get for free what "I" work for
b. they broke the laws and the rules, so why "reward" them
c. they are a burden on me as a taxpayer
Now, for all those that use those as a rational, I again ask for each of the points:
a. don't deserve to get for free what "I" work for
Q: So you ENVY them?; do you want to trade places with them?; does their getting something that you don't get for free somehow take away from your good fortune (that's the scarcity principle...look it up)?
b. they broke the laws and the rules
Q: Is a law that is not enforced really a law? Some here have said that laws should help the people, are we sure enforcing this law would HELP more than it would hurt?
c. they are a burden on me as a taxpayer
Q: Can anyone quantify that burden, in real dollars, in percentage of taxes paid by the average family? Do that, and we can talk...often I think it's the depressed states and the states with high costs of living that use the "illegals" as a scapegoat for their other problems. People like to complain about causes when times are bad.
Like I said, read the link, be a little introspective, tone down the emotion, then let's talk....
TJR
