V8 swap would it be worth it over all?

[Don Donaldson]

I have been seriously considering and engine replacement for a while now amongst other things and I considered upgrading to a V8...



Well I just finished pricing all the needed parts out for a complete V8 swap using a new "long block" sensors, water pump, hoses and transmission from advance auto parts and getting the rest from a junk yard, and it seems in order to do it the cost would be at least 5,000 or more. and that would be a non-performance stock explorer v8 with transmission.



my question is: Is the ford 302 V8 so much better than the v6 I have as far as performance and reliability that it warrants doing a v8 engine swap?



For the same price I could put new v6 and supercharge it using an explorer express kit. If its really worth it I may still consider it but as for right now the better thing to do seems to replace my rattling v6 with a new one and do performance mods to that. Although it is important to note that I believe that the sohc 4.0 that is in my sport trac is a terrible design (rattling timing chains should NEVER happen). The V8 mod is a lot of work and I still haven't figured out all the details (like the compatible drive shafts). -I plan on doing the engine replacement soon as now my v6 rattles all the time regardless and its gotten much louder so I seriously doubt its reliability:angry:.



Thanks for all your advise.

-Don D.

 

[Andy Chase]

I can tell you from personal experience the 302 5.0 is a very reliable engine except for the cheap starters Ford used in them. My 93 F-150 has a 5.0 w/ 276K on it (i know the whole history, I bought it from my dad which he bought new in 92). I have replaced the alternator at 198K, waterpump (which wasn't completely shot yet) at 240K and added a new distributor at 260K. Otherthan that the engine has been great. I can't personally say about the reliablity fo the 4.0 yet as I've only had mine for less than a year now.

 

[TrainTrac]

Don D.



Didn't you already pose the V8 swap question in this thread?

 

[Nelson Atwell]

Maybe he wanted a different answer.



I wouldn't advise it. Just slapping a bigger engine in, could not only be difficult, but also cause unforseen damage, especially related to the front suspension. The front end isn't designed to hold the additional weight a V-8 would weigh.

 

[TrainTrac]

The front end isn't designed to hold the additional weight a V-8 would weigh.

It's not?:huh: Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it basically the same front end as a 2001 Explorer, in which the 5.0L V8 was an option?

 

[Richard L]

There are a number of issues that you will need to resolvee before you can swap an older 302 V8 into the Gen-1 Sport Trac.



1. The Gen-1 Sport Trac nose is based on the Explorer Sport and was not made to accept any of the popular Ford V8's So the V8 will not just drop in and bolt up. There will be a lot of fabrication and modifying of parts as well as the engine bay to accept any V8.



2. None of the existing ECU computers are compatible with the old engines ahd the Sport Trac.



3. Many states do not allow replacing an engine with one from an older year model. That may actually make it illegal to drive on the highway, and cause you to fail any polution testing or safety insspections.



I think the days of the engime swaps are quickly going away Since it appears that you are looking at this possible swap from a finacial vew point, I think you would be far better off financially to just replace the V6 with a rebuilt V6, or buy a new truck with a V8.

 

[Bill Barber]

302 and our 4.0s are within 20 lbs of each other.

 

[Dreman]

Find a 2001 v8 Explorer or Mountaineer for a parts vehicle. All of the parts you need to make the swap should be there since the body and chassis in the 2001 Explorer is the same as your 2001 Explorer Sport Trac. The ECU from the 2001 Explorer should be a direct swap for the ECU in your 2001 Sport Trac, so no emissions laws are violated. As I understand it, there are a few custom parts needed for the 302 to fit, but the 2001 v8 Explorer should have them already installed.



The base 302 is not much stronger than a decent 4.0, but the 302 can be made much, much more than the 4.0.

 

[Chad Merry]

A 98-01 Explorer V-8 is needed to the swap. It will drop right in using the explorer engine and tranny. You will also need the entire wire harness from the donor vehicle. The biggest thing to overcome is the PATS system. And you need to check your local laws for emissions, as you will be putting an older engine in a newer vehicle.



And as far as weight of vehicles, our ST's are heavier than a V-8 explorer. And are indentical from the doors forward.

 

[Richard L]

The Gen-1 Sport Trac engine compartment is not the same as the early V6 Explorer. The early Sport Trac engine compartment is based on the Explorer Sport which never had a V8 for just that reason. If the V8 would have fit, Ford would have put on in before the 2007 model.



This issue has been discussed numerous time here yet nobody jumps in and said they have done a V8 swap and tells everyone what it took to do it. The Ford engineers at the early Louisville meets said that a V8 would not fit and I'm sure that they would have done it if it was possible.



Also, you cannot assume that earlier mode ECU computers will work either. Hell, the 2001 Sport Trac had about 3 or 4 different ECU's that could not be interchanged but an ECU that matches the engine would have the best chance of working.



The other problem with using an earlier ECU is that the 5 speed overdrive Automatic was a new transmission for the 2001 model year and it is also controlled by the ECU computer so I seriously doubt that an earlier ECU would even remotely handle the 5 speed transmission. So you would need to go with a manual transmission but the earlier Explorer V8's did not come with manual transmissions so the early V9 ECU's probably would not work, unless you swtich to the older 4 speed automatic tramsmission. Notice how these little differences are doing a lot of Ca-Chings on the cash register.



Again, from a purely financial perspective you are throwing away a lot of money for a V8 with little or no chance to recoup any of your investment, Simply replacing the old engine with a rebuilt 4.0L SOHC replacement is a far better choice financially.



...Rich

 

[Dallas Starr]

do what tonkatrac did and put in a small chevy 350

 

[Dan Long]

I was inches from doing this swap, but just couldn't find the time. I had my 2000 Explorer 5.0 and my 2001 ST sitting side by side. The engine compartments, frame rails, etc are identical. The 5.0 will bolt in with the correct mounts. You will need to use the engine wiring harness and ECU from the 5.0. You will also use the 4 speed tranny and transfer case (if present) from the 5.0. The 5.0 also has a special power brake booster that should be swapped. You will need a custom or modified driveshaft for the rear end, the front shaft should still work if using a AWD 5.0 and a 4x4 ST. You will have to deal with the Vehicle Speed Sensor as they used different setups for each truck. Other than that, with a donor 99-01 Explorer vehicle you should have ~almost~ every nut and bolt needed. I wouldn't attempt the swap without a full donor vehicle though, as the minor stuff will nickle and dime you to the poor house.



The engineers at Ford were speaking of the modular V-8's (4.6 and 5.4). They're MUCH wider than the 5.0 and will not fit without considerable work, but they have been done as well.

 

[Tom Schindler]

The Gen-1 Sport Trac engine compartment is not the same as the early V6 Explorer. The early Sport Trac engine compartment is based on the Explorer Sport which never had a V8 for just that reason. If the V8 would have fit, Ford would have put on in before the 2007 model.

Yea right. I own both a Sport Trac and a 4 door explorer. They are identical under the hood. Exact same bolts, same everything. I could take a picture under the hood and they are identical.



A V8 swap would work. If someone wants to donate the ST, I will prove all these nay sayers wrong.





Tom

 

[Chad Merry]

The Gen-1 Sport Trac engine compartment is not the same as the early V6 Explorer. The early Sport Trac engine compartment is based on the Explorer Sport which never had a V8 for just that reason. If the V8 would have fit, Ford would have put on in before the 2007 model.

Sorry Richard are way incorrect. I have seen Explorer Sport's with V-8's. And again an engine and tranny, ECU and wire harness from a 98-01 Explorer will drop right in place. Just because Ford did not do it, in the first place means nothing. There is a lot of things Ford should have done differently

The Ford engineers at the early Louisville meets said that a V8 would not fit and I'm sure that they would have done it if it was possible

The engineers you spoke with are wrong.

Also, you cannot assume that earlier mode ECU computers will work either. Hell, the 2001 Sport Trac had about 3 or 4 different ECU's that could not be interchanged but an ECU that matches the engine would have the best chance of working.

You need to use the ECU from the donor vehicle. The reason it is better to use a 98-01 model is because of the fuel line return system, is identical to the ST's. Later model became returnless.

The other problem with using an earlier ECU is that the 5 speed overdrive Automatic was a new transmission for the 2001 model year and it is also controlled by the ECU computer so I seriously doubt that an earlier ECU would even remotely handle the 5 speed transmission. So you would need to go with a manual transmission but the earlier Explorer V8's did not come with manual transmissions so the early V9 ECU's probably would not work, unless you swtich to the older 4 speed automatic tramsmission. Notice how these little differences are doing a lot of Ca-Chings on the cash register.

The tranny from the donor vehicle will bolt right in place. And again you use the ECU from the donor vehicle. And if you have a 4x4 you are way better off using a t-case from an F-150 to get the manual shift style in lieu of the electronic shift.





I had this all planned out for my ST but due to emission laws where I live, I cannot put an older engine in my ST and pass inspection. I am still trying to find a way around that.

 

[Bill Barber]

Forget the 302, do this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6iQCWgrJec

 

[TrainTrac]

Linked for the lazy...

 

[Johnny O]

do what tonkatrac did and put in a small chevy 350

Not a problem if emissions and making the computer work properly is not an issue. Drop in a carb'd V-8 and wire the gauges and ignition like a street rod. The issues arise when you try to make the stock stuff work like stock and pass an emissions test.

 

[Richard L]

Chad,

Don't tell me that you've seen early Explorer Sports with V8's and imply that they were bolt in swaps. Show me an article or someone who has done it and can explain every step that it took, parts required, and money spent doing that swap.



I never said it could not be done!, Hell I've seen Chevy V8's in rear engined Porsches. If you nave mor meny than brains you can do almost anything.



I told Don that financially it was not a practical swap and that just swapping to the rebuilt stock V6 was much more cost effective. That non only includes the cost of parts, labor, and time as well as the fact that a 10 year old 302 V8 is probably going to need to be rebuilt anyway. Add the cost of transmission and possibly the need to rebuild that as well, I would say that kind of swap would easily double the cost of just installing a rebuilt stock V6.



Also consider the fact that there are over 12K members here and the site has been in existence since late 2000, yet no member has put a V8 into their Sport Trac yet ! If anyone has they have not provided us any evidence, any facts about the parts, the problems and the cost, and not even a photograph? This site has people posting projects and photos of every conceivable mod, yet you expect me to believe that you can just bolt a V8 in a Gen-1 Sport Trac when the Ford engineers said it would not fit !!



I don't claim tha the Ford engineers are correct, but until you can prove that they are incorrect by providing proof of a Sport Trac with a V8 installed for less than the cost of a rebuilt V6.



In fact a cheaper solution for Don would be to just get a low mileage stock V6 out of a wrecked Sport Trac and it would be cheaper and easier than any of the other options. If he just want's a V8 that badly, he would be far better off just buying a used 2007-2008 Sport Trac with the V8 already installed and perhaps with some residual warranty.



...Rich

 

[Chad Merry]

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=196579



http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=174211



Here are 2 threads about this mod. There at least 4-5 people who posted in that thread that have done the mod, including 1 Ranger.



And please don't feel that since something has not been posted on this site as a project that it cannot be done. If you live like that you will miss out on alot of mods. I have done several mods to my ST that are not posted here. Remember all 1995-2001 Explorers and Mountaineers are identical to the Sport Trac from the doors forward.

 

[Richard L]

Chad,

Your links prove nothing. All that is there are people wishfully talking about V8 swaps into a Sport Trac, pretty much the same that is done here.



Anyone can say they put a V8 into a Sport Trac, but nobody is posting pictures, a project, or the parts and cost of such a swap.



There are over 12K member here who will post a project on how to change a tailight bulb to swaping the rear drums for disk brakes. I will not accept that someone has put a V8 in their Gen-1 Sport Trac without posting pictures, a project or at least describing how they did it.



Again, I am not saying it cannot be done, it's not a simple bolt-in swap and is just far too much work to be practical. Yes someone could hack up the engine compartment to make room for a V8, but few have the skills to do it right and make it look good to. And as of today, nobody has shown me a V8 in a Sport Trac.



...Rich