Removing CATS for MPG

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TowTrac

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Mar 19, 2005
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Location
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I'm looking to remove my cat. converter so I can improve my MPG. I know it's illegal, and it supposidly hurts the enviroment etc etc etc. But I have a house to pay for and and kids to feed so if gas to to $4.00 again I'll will do it no matter what. Lets just put all that aside for the moment and try ot see if we the result of removing them.

I know the need an XCAL tuner to fix the computer problem. but what are the engineering issues related to engine operation once they are removed?

Any info would be appreciated.



Thanks
 
Not going to hurt the motor. You will need a program to turn off the O2 Sensor after the last cat. You really wont recoup the price of the exhaust work, for a long time though in mpg. If your not looking for performance I wouldnt do it. That is the only reason I have the RT-ypipe, is performance.
 
Towtrac,



I got rid of my '04 ST back in '07 because of gas price, doing what I needed to do in order to help make ends meet for our family, so I know the feeling.



I don't think you will save any money in the long run if you remove the cat; and you might end up with a vehicle that won't pass inspection (does Fla have emissions inspections?)



TJR
 
You will not gain any mpg by removing the cat...you could potentially hurt the performance of the vehicle and mpg could actually decrease.
 
Even if you gained 1 MPG by removing the cat, you are still in the hole.



On a tank of 22 gallons, you are going 22 miles further. Awesome! 22 miles. At 18 MPG, that is about 1.22 gallons of fuel saved. Now we are talking! XCAL tuner will cost over $300.00, but lets just say $300.00 for sake of argument.



Now, with a savings of $4.88 per tank, it will take just over 61 tank fulls to pay for the XCAL. At an average of 18 MPG, you would need to drive about 24,000 miles to break even. Roughly about 1 1/2 years of driving.



In the end, you are not saving a dime, are commiting a felony, not gaining anything, wasting money, and putting yourself into a situation that could cause you more headaches than you can imagine.



Of course, it is your vehicle. You do what you want.





Tom
 
The South has to rise again before it can fall, and sadly that isn't going to happen anytime soon.



How is Florida not having emissions testing slow (ponderous)? I'd say it is fast because it is ahead of its time. Same with certain counties of my state. Everyone knows they don't look under the vehicle here, so the cat delete is common, and they know it too, it's just another fee for the privilege of using the roads that we already pay for.



22 extra miles is a good thing to have on those roadtrips, because I personally consider range to be important, as there are times where the is no gas station around. I'm paying for the increased performance with my mods and the extra range. I have to break my 550 miles on one tank record somehow :D



Why does one have to buy the XCal for the delete? Why can't those 50 dollar "sensor deletes" that plug into the O2 sensor cord be used instead?



When removing a catalytic converter is actually considered a felony, I'll loose all respect for the legal system...oh wait. :eek:





 
You will also have to add in the cost of reconstructing the exhaust system. This may double Tom's estimate...
 
All of you guys have valid points. Of course it is a legal choice one has to make since it is against the law. I have heard that torque can be lost as well. I'll probably remove 3 out of the four and get an XCAL. I drive about 5000 miles a month so most likley I may end up gettin my money back.



I would sell the truck but I'm a contractor and need atleast an ST for work.

This will need to start a new thread, but look at the opposite side of emissions & global warming there is a strong arguement that global warming and vehicle emissions etc are not realed. California has smog because of lack of trade winds and mountains. florida has a good sea breaze from west to east so our smog is pushed into the ocean.



Thanks for everyone being polite professional and mature enough to hold a conversation about an question. It's nice to see/hear from people with some common sense & decency.
 
I'll probably remove 3 out of the four and get an XCAL.
Click to expand...



How 'bout just getting a Random Technology Y-pipe and high-flow cat from Zabteck? They're direct bolt-on replacements, and don't require a new tune.
 
Because ~1000 USD is more expensive than even the approximated max price of 300 to just hack the piece of junk off and put a piece of pipe in there.



Why do you have to "reconstruct" the exhaust system, and why would that cost 300 more dollars? What, besides aesthetics, is wrong with just clamping a piece of pipe in where the 2 converters were?
 
A dealer can hold the owner responsible for bringing the exhaust back to legal specs when the vehicle is traded in. Also, I've had my exhaust shop tell me that they refuse to work on systems in which cats have been tampered with.



I really don't see any benefit in tampering with the cat system.
 
Mark is correct..



It is a FEDERAL standard. Thus, no matter if your STATE does or does not enforce the law, the vehicle upon being sold is expected to be to Federal standards.



A dealer will enforce this standard if it is their intention to sell the vehicle. If you sell it to a private individual, and he/she takes it to a location that does enforce the emissions standard, they have the legal right to come back to the seller to bring the vehicle back Federal standards...



That said, often, vehicle is scrapped when traded in and or is sold to a private person with no issues as they live within the State standards as the seller..
 
TowTrac,



One thing to consider if you are a contractor using your truck to drive 5,000 miles a month. I have to assume most of those miles are work related. If so, you should be able to deduct mileage as a business expense. If you are NOT already deducting your miles then doing that alone will save you more money than removing the cats.



TJR
 
Doesn't matter if FL tests or not, removing it is still against Federal law. My understanding is that while the Random Tech Y-pipe replaces the pre-cats, your truck will still pass emissions.
 
Why do you have to "reconstruct" the exhaust system, and why would that cost 300 more dollars? What, besides aesthetics, is wrong with just clamping a piece of pipe in where the 2 converters were?
Click to expand...



Safety reasons and it's a little more involved than just clamping a piece of pipe in place. It's a Y-pipe configuration attached to the exhaust manifolds.
 
Doesn't add up in the cost vs. benefit. The system is designed for it, probably very little real benefit, but definite cost and risk. I'd look for other ways to save a buck.
 
Because ~1000 USD is more expensive than even the approximated max price of 300 to just hack the piece of junk off and put a piece of pipe in there.
Click to expand...



The R/T products together run about $798 from Zabteck. They also keep you in compliance with the aforementioned Federal laws.



The parts & labor for "hacking" off the OEM Y-pipe's pre-cats and the two main cats and replacing them with straight pipe, combined with the ~$400 for an XCal 3 with new tunes will probably be darn close to the cost for the R/T products.



Either way, I don't think that enough of an MPG improvement will be gained to justify the expense.



Towtrac,



The least expensive (free) thing you can do to improve MPG is just watch your speed, and employ "hyper-miling" techniques. At highway speed, the Trac seems to achieve the best MPG at between 55-65 MPH.



If you're looking for something that will really help you improve MPG, then buy a a ScanGauge II. It will provide you with real time MPG info, allowing you to adjust your driving habits to achieve optimal MPG. It runs between $120-$150, depending on the vendor. Sometimes you can even find used ones for sale cheaper than that. Search the internet for the best deal.



 
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