OT: Request For Comment/Review

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Thomas Rogers

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Our younger son wants a video iPod or similar for X-mas.



I have narrowed my search and am focusing on the 30GB Creative ZEN Vision:M. My reasons are longer battery life, off-the-shelf battery and wider codec support than the Apple video iPod. And, I personally don't like iTunes and suspect my son and I will use Amazon.com's new unBox for downloads, as well as our own DVD rips.



Can anyone share their thoughts on the Creative ZEN Vision:M, especially those that own them?



Thanks,



TJR
 
They have a good article in MONEY magazine, 9/06! Talks about the Creative Zen V! I'm leaning that way also! Looks like a good deal!
 
If he is planning on using the unBox then the best bet would be to check to see if the Creative ZEN is compatible with that service. My understanding is that unBox only supports a very small subset of the players out there.



30 gigs is also pretty tiny for video. I wouldn't go less than 60 or 80 gig personally.

 
Pretty sure it is...because when you go to Amazon.com and look at their listing for the Zen unBox panel ads are right in your face. I will make sure though before pulling the trigger. I would have hoped the unBox isn't proprietary in the sense that it has to support different devices, but instead supports every device that is seen by the PC as a USB storage device (which is the way all device mfgrs should design their stuff, IMHO).



Just held the Zen Vision:M and the Video iPod at Best Buy....the video iPod to me has one big advantage, and that's its slimer size, but that's it. Navigating with one vs the other isn't that big a deal, battery life is better on the Zen, and picture quality seems about the same on both. The support for Divx and Xvid by the Zen is giving it a slightly tipped scale on the advantage meter.



P.S. Just reread Amazon.com's description of the Zen ...works great with unBox!



TJR
 
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As far as I know, all video content services are proprietary. Either they use iTunes or the use WiMP or some other 3rd party tool to copy the videos to your MP3 player. The copy & drag system of the past has been buried under the avalanche of DRM.



What version of the iPod were you looking at? They released new ones yesterday that doubled the battery life.



Another option is to find a PDA and a 4 gig SD card. Same price point but it will let you do a whole lot more than an iPod or Zen would let you do.
 
I get what you are saying, but copy and drag doesn't have to fall by the wayside with DRM. Microsoft's DRM allows for manual copying of digital files...if more device mfgrs would simply adopt it.



I'm not sure which vid ipod I looked at, but I won't be getting a video iPod...too closed. I agree with the PDA route as a possibility. Maybe an iPaq or something like that.



TJR
 
Thanks Statik13, and I have since seen that the Creative Zen doesn't act as a UMS (universal mass storage) device, meaning it doesn't look like a USB drive but is proprietary. And, the batteries are proprietary as well...both of which make it not that much better than the new iPod Video...except the Zen does support more formats.



TJR
 
The creative Zen Vision 30 and 60 are the way to go if you want a product that is not a proprietary format(ipod) you can also record directly to MP3 from the line in input.



I just held a Zen "W" last week... wide screen HDTV format player VERY NICE, I think he qouted $399.00 list. Should be available soon!



The Zen Developement lead visited our University because we are starting to develope a possible podcasting program



:D
 
Just read the money.cnn.com review of unBox, and the author really hammered it. But I can't help but feel after reading the review that the major complaints were about download speed, DRM, and fact that as a substitute for DVDs on a big screen TV the DL service pales. To which I say..."Yeah!" If he wants the DVD experience, quality and simplicity, then stick with DVDs. If you want lower quality "video on the go", then go with a PMP (personal media player) and a service like unBox. The only other alternative to satisfy both worlds is to buy DVDs and rip them...and if your going to go that route (and it does seem that a majority of the content that will go on my sons player will be from ripped dvds), then it probably doesn't matter much about the unbox vs itunes service comparison. The question then is which players support more formats.
 
Zen Vision 30 and 60 are the way to go if you want a product that is not a proprietary format
Click to expand...

The Zen Vision is a nice machine, but I think your mistaken to believe it is not proprietary. They are just proprietary to Microsoft instead of Apple. The only truly unproprietary player I can think of is iRiver as they support Ogg Vorbis.



TJR, If you are ripping your own DVDs, Is format really a concern? I'd worry more that you can find software to make the ripping as easy as possible.



The media convertor (Name escapes me right now) I use lets me pop a DVD in my drive, walk away and it automatically rips the movie, converts it to whatever format, resolution & bitrate I have set, and uploads it into iTunes. All I need to do is sync my palm pilot and I'm set.



One step instead of the three (Rip, Convert, Copy) that I used to do. If I had a video iPod instead of the palm pilot, it would automagically sync for me too, so I could even cut out that step.



CNN is supposed to post the article on the iPod video store tomorrow. Personally, I hope they rip it as bad as they did the unTune one. If I'm forking out $20 for a download I better be getting the same quality that my $20 will buy me at the video store.

 
Yes, Statik13, I do think the format is key as there are many, many DVD rippers out there that support Divx and Xvid, and I tend to like those formats over MPEG4. And, yes, I have already found a couple of fairly easy to use pieces of software that rip and convert in one step and do so far quicker than "real time" (about 1/3 real-time for xvid)...copying would be an extra step. Once we settle on one I will let you know which.



As for cost vs quality, I'm not looking for DVD quality in downloaded video. I would rather trade quality for smaller size, that's why xvid and divx are very appealing to me. Take a look at an XVID or DIVX encoded episode of Battlestar Galactica from Bittorrent, then compare that to the quality of what you get for the same episode downloaded from iTunes. The quality difference is quite striking...the iTune versions aren't as good, and they are about the same size. Still, I don't want a 2GB+ file to download for an hour of video, which is what MPEG2 would be...I want about 1/10th that size, and they look JUST FINE played on a PC or on a 2.5" video player screen. Blown up on my 55" mitsu HD, they look like crap. Then, you need at LEAST dvd quality. It is for these reasons that I think the episodes and movies available from iTunes, unBox, Movielink, etc must be *significantly* lower cost than their DVD counterparts. If they are the same or more, then I will buy the DVD...that way it works on my home theater and can be ripped to a lower res for the personal player.



TJR
 
TJR, Definitely let me know what program you go with, I'm looking for a good PC version and haven't found one yet. (I usually rip the DVDs on my powerbook, but my PC has more disk space so would be preferable).



Sounds like we're on the same page for the download stuff. I'd have no trouble paying $5 for a movie that I can watch on my PMP, but once they start charging DVD prices it better be DVD quality, or mail me the DVD at a later date to go wtih the low quality video.



Have you looked into the <a href='http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zune'>Microsoft Zune</a> yet? It is supposed to play a huge variety of videos & audio, including the new H.264 compression. (Although oddly, it doesn't play any microsoft "plays for sure" drmed files).
 
Will let you know, Statik. I tried two different download-for-a-fee (with free trial) rippers. Both had great quality, speed and ease of use, but one had a noticeable pause in the video every 3 seconds....I say noticeable but it really wasn't bad...just a little stutter than on smooth motion movements onscreen seemed a little unsettling. Having written transcoders I recognized that as a buffering problem. Then, I tried another and it worked just as well, but with not stutter. Both programs I saw were probably made by "single guy" operations, and both cost between $25 and $35.



TJR
 

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