Massive protesting in Wisconsin (U.S.A.)

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Very interesting to watch this unfold... State Union employees, (and thousands from across the country) are finally drawing the line in the sand against anti worker agendas of certain state Governors. I do believe that there will be a lot more of this to come.



Thoughts?

 

[Mark K 2]

Too bad Jesse Jackson has stuck his nose into the Wisconsin protests. That bastard carries way too much baggage and will only bring down the effectiveness of the protests.

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

I agree it is not a Black issue..it is a worker issue. Hes small potatoz!

 

[Bill V]

I'm all for the protests. I see no issue with playing hardball with the unions--but simply making them (effectively) illegal flies too much in the face of basic worker rights.



Just curious, Frank--why did you put "(U.S.A.)" in the subject line? Are you thinking that there are people on this board who are unaware that WI is part of the US? (If that's the case, that's fine, I have no beefs with you on it--although the fact that anyone would question the general population's knowledge of this is quite an indictment on the public as a whole...)

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Bill V>>



So the reader, and possible responder knows that we are not talking Egypt here. Even though the protests are every bit as big. (but more civil)

 

[Bud Williams]

Where's Ronald Reagan at to fire all those worthless Government School Teachers!?!

:bwahaha:



So much for "....the children!" striking and having to close the government schools is not serving the needs of the students....

 

[Mark K 2]

There are two separate issues and governor Walker sees them as a single problem.



There's the budget issue and there's the union issue. The government workers and teachers had already offered to pay the share of the pensions and health insruance. It should have been a done deal. But, Walker pulled the rug out from under the workers' feet. He insists that simply having collective bargaining as a right is a drain on the state budget.



It seems a lot of the folks who voted for Walker think he's going beyond the scope of the budget by busting all the unions. A survey by a Madison TV station shows 70% of the people are against the governor's plan. There's already a recall petition in the works.

 

[Bud Williams]

Most Americans think government sector employees should not be in unions...

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Bud..where do you get this stuff??



The International Business Times?? Well at least we all know you are on the side of big business Bud.



Get R Done!

 

[Bill V]

So much for "....the children!" striking and having to close the government schools is not serving the needs of the students....

You couldn't be further from the truth. Seeing teachers standing up for themselves against Walker is the best civics lesson these kids could get.



Why do I get the feeling that if the governor were to declare that teachers need to work for 1 cent an hour, and the teachers refused, you'd still blame the teachers for not "serving the needs of the students". If anyone's not serving the students' needs here, it's Walker and the Republican legislature...

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Bill>> Bud would want to cut the pay to half a cent!! HA CRACKER!!!

 

[DaninVa]

I cannot find anywhere in the U.S. Constitution that there is a "right" to a job. I also think that those who work for the "people" in any governmental job should be held to a higher standard than those in the private sector.

 

[OLE442]

So the reader, and possible responder knows that we are not talking Egypt here

I still can't understand why anyone would need to put "(USA)" in the title that refers to "Wisconsin" in it. Frank, you're not the only one who would know that Wisconsin isn't in Egypt?



And I don't get the

HA CRACKER!!!

comment? :throwup:Minister King Samir Shabazz?? Really, really great humanoid to be quoting IMO!



At any rate, I understand the union thing and I also understand the fact that the states are armpit deep in debt and the currents getting faster and faster. The city and state union thing creates a lot of folks who milk the system and who don't exactly follow the "fair days work for a fair days pay" theory IMO! I also see so many upper management/supervisor and their friends and relatives also not following that theory either. I think the state problem is also like the Washington system....neither side is really working for the common man, they're all (a large percentage) are in it for what they and theirs can get! :throwup:



Pretty sad indeed....IMO!nline:

 

[Johnny O]

Lessee if I got this right. The oppressed middle class with a declining standard of living, wages, and benefits, due to Boosh's policies, have to kick in more money to maintain the standard of living, wages, and benefits of unionized government employees who by definition are not oppressed since they are represented by unions supported by Obama's policies. Is that about it? :haveabeer:

 

[Mark K 2]

70,000 protesters on Saturday. Pro-labor concert planned for Monday evening on the Capitol grounds. It's to the point here where every Wisconsinite personally knows someone protesting in Madison. My neighbor had a sign-making party this morning. A good friend of mine who's a conservative Constitutionalist (and never sees eye-to-eye with me politically) has taken the side of pro-labor and will be pulling a two-day shift at the Capitol starting on Tuesday. I nearly shit a brick when he told me...

 

[Frank screwyourednecks]

Yes Mark..The educated know deep down what is right, and what is BEST for our economy and Country. The Union movement has shifted into overdrive, and I can't wait to see what happens in the next few years. The middle class will be back!!!! Work Union...Live BETTER. Its our turn FINALLY!!

 

[Johnny O]

I'd say the country has been run almost exclusively by Harvard and Yale people for 20 years (and I don't just mean Presidents) and they've gotten us into the shit we're in now.

 

[Bill V]

Lessee if I got this right. The oppressed middle class with a declining standard of living, wages, and benefits, due to Boosh's policies, have to kick in more money to maintain the standard of living, wages, and benefits of unionized government employees who by definition are not oppressed since they are represented by unions supported by Obama's policies. Is that about it?

Nope, that's not it at all. In some ways, you're missing the point, and in others, you have it 180 degrees backwards.



First of all, this has nothing to do with the budget or any costs, regardless of how Walker and the WI Repubs try to disguise it. The unions have already gone on record saying that they're willing to make pretty much all of the financial concessions being requested by the governor. This is solely about simply having the right to collectively bargain and unionize. Rather than playing hardball with the unions, Walker wants to effectively outlaw them. That's it-no finances, no budget--walker is simply trying to bar state employees from standing up for themselves collectively.



Secondly, even if this were about the state budget--it wouldn't be a case of "the oppressed middle class" having to increase what they pay for the same services. Rather, it would be a case of the "middle class" demanding that the "oppressed state workers" continue to provide the same level of service but demanding/forcing a reduction in what they're willing to pay. And that's simply not how budgeting works. If you're reducing your family's budget, you don't keep insisting on getting all the same products and services you've gotten in the past, and just tell the providers of those products and services that you'll be paying them less. Instead, you chose which of the items you value more than the others, pay the going rate for those items, and then go without the other items. This is where Walker has lost touch with reality--instead of cutting anything, he's demanding that everyone provide the same services at a lower rate, and making it illegal for people to insist on fair compensation. If the "oppressed middle class" wants to pay less, then they need to expect reduced services as a result. They can't have reduced costs and same/increased services simultaneously.

 

[Johnny O]

Bill V...but that is partly how govt budgeting should work. Assuming WI relies partly on a state income tax, when the income of the taxpayers goes down then the money received by the govt will go down too. I'm not aware that they governor is asking them to take less gross pay, only to kick in more for health ins and pensions, which will result in less net pay. "Skin in the game" I think Obama calls it.



That said, I do not think that govt employees at any level should be allowed to unionize. You have a monopoly on both sides then. It is not a competitive atmosphere that keeps both sides more honest. In the private sector there is a practical limit to how much a company can pay out (and not go out of business). The govt will never go out of business and come contract renegotiation time the unions are bargaining across the table from the same politicians they helped to elect. Conflict of interest.



Federal employees have only been allowed to unionize since 1963. The country didn't go to hell in a handbasket prior to that.

 

[Mark K 2]

The protest is getting more organized. They're now sending out daily itineraries and statewide event plans. There was a protest a few miles from me with 700 people at a major intersection. It even made the TV news in Minneapolis/St. Paul.