47% Will Pay No Income Taxes for 2009
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TomT
Well-Known Member
Flat tax. So easy, so fair, but for some reason congress won't enact. Democrats or Republicans.
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
Shoot, I had to pay the Man, and I made such a piddling amount that I should be saying "Can't touch this" to the IRS, but nyooooo.
Clearly I need to come up with some, ah, contrived deductions and credits for 2010.
Hooray for Socialism
Edit:Flat tax for income just ain't cool. Flat tax for property would make a lot of sense, considering that property only gains value by the actions of private citizens. Why should we have to pay the state more as penalty for the improvements of private citizens?
Clearly I need to come up with some, ah, contrived deductions and credits for 2010.
Hooray for Socialism
Edit:Flat tax for income just ain't cool. Flat tax for property would make a lot of sense, considering that property only gains value by the actions of private citizens. Why should we have to pay the state more as penalty for the improvements of private citizens?
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Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
We all know the "story" about inviting the rich man to lunch and how that ends...
Keep it up USA...taxing the rich more is only hurting us.
TJR
Keep it up USA...taxing the rich more is only hurting us.
TJR
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
Aw TJR, clearly you haven't heard this "Oats to Sparrows" argument, which shows the truth of the commonplace "Taxing the rich hurts the middle-class and poor" lie.
...and Capitalism is bad because Atlas Shrugged was, which is because Ayn Rand wrote a Mary Sue character and sought to surround herself with obsequious Objectivists,and denigrated any nay-sayers.
(I mention this because my coworker sitting 8 feet away saw this post and went on a rant, of which I've mentioned the main--illogical--points just for grins..minus the profanity) :argue::argue::smack:
...and Capitalism is bad because Atlas Shrugged was, which is because Ayn Rand wrote a Mary Sue character and sought to surround herself with obsequious Objectivists,and denigrated any nay-sayers.
(I mention this because my coworker sitting 8 feet away saw this post and went on a rant, of which I've mentioned the main--illogical--points just for grins..minus the profanity) :argue::argue::smack:
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
KL,
Truth? What is that? I haven't seen the truth in so long I don't know what it looks like anymore.
TJR
Truth? What is that? I haven't seen the truth in so long I don't know what it looks like anymore.
TJR
Enact the fair tax and we all win. Illegals will pay more tax than legals will and we get to keep all of our pay check.
Hiring "under the table" will be a thing of the past.
Tom
Hiring "under the table" will be a thing of the past.
Tom
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
Eh, I advocate no income tax, but ah suppose fair tax would be an acceptable compromise.
TJR, I don't know what Truth is either, with or without underline...it's like the Ark of the Covenant, no one knows what it really looks like. We can only form impressions of its form from ancient artifacts that depict a vague representation of its shape.
(Referencing the gold artwork which is said to show the Ark in the Tabernacle, per History International--aka The Religion Channel--'s special on the Ark)
Though how anyone can be so ignorant to read Atlas Shrugged and say that it led to them hating Capitalism is beyond me...of course, my coworkers pronounce it as "Ann Rand", which explains much.
Fair Tax won't stop people from being hired under the table, or paid under the table, it'll just mean that the people paid or hired in any fashion should (key word) be paying taxes on that income, should they elect to buy anything.
TJR, I don't know what Truth is either, with or without underline...it's like the Ark of the Covenant, no one knows what it really looks like. We can only form impressions of its form from ancient artifacts that depict a vague representation of its shape.
(Referencing the gold artwork which is said to show the Ark in the Tabernacle, per History International--aka The Religion Channel--'s special on the Ark)
Though how anyone can be so ignorant to read Atlas Shrugged and say that it led to them hating Capitalism is beyond me...of course, my coworkers pronounce it as "Ann Rand", which explains much.
Fair Tax won't stop people from being hired under the table, or paid under the table, it'll just mean that the people paid or hired in any fashion should (key word) be paying taxes on that income, should they elect to buy anything.
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
KL said:
I'm confused by what you mean.
I was under the impression that the fair tax eliminates the income tax, and SSI and Medicare taxes on income and replaces theses taxes with a national sales tax.
If that's the correct definition, then under a Fair Tax there is hiring or paying "under the table" anymore. At least not by the common definition of "under the table", which is employed but NOT paying income taxes.
So, Fair Tax eliminates the ability to "hire under the table", and eliminates all taxes on income.
See what I'm trying to say?
I think you might be confusing "Fair Tax" with "Flat Tax".
TJR
I'm confused by what you mean.
I was under the impression that the fair tax eliminates the income tax, and SSI and Medicare taxes on income and replaces theses taxes with a national sales tax.
If that's the correct definition, then under a Fair Tax there is hiring or paying "under the table" anymore. At least not by the common definition of "under the table", which is employed but NOT paying income taxes.
So, Fair Tax eliminates the ability to "hire under the table", and eliminates all taxes on income.
See what I'm trying to say?
I think you might be confusing "Fair Tax" with "Flat Tax".
TJR
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
No suhr, ah don't believe ah am.
Hiring under the Table means that the employee is not recorded on any company record, not just that their pay is secreted to them to be untaxed.
If I had a business and I wanted to hire someone to do something, whether they be El Salvadorenos to cut my grass or software engineers to help out on a project, and I didn't want anyone to know, for reasons of legality or prestige, I'd hire them under the table.
"under the table" means to do something discreetly, not specifically meaning "to avoid Federal income taxes". You may assert that the connotation of the phrase means exclusively the latter, but I for one would then refuse to accept such a bastardization of a useful phrase.
Hiring under the Table means that the employee is not recorded on any company record, not just that their pay is secreted to them to be untaxed.
If I had a business and I wanted to hire someone to do something, whether they be El Salvadorenos to cut my grass or software engineers to help out on a project, and I didn't want anyone to know, for reasons of legality or prestige, I'd hire them under the table.
"under the table" means to do something discreetly, not specifically meaning "to avoid Federal income taxes". You may assert that the connotation of the phrase means exclusively the latter, but I for one would then refuse to accept such a bastardization of a useful phrase.
Nick Miller
Active Member
People who don't like the "fair tax" could buy stuff "under the table".
Thomas Rogers
Well-Known Member
KL,
Gotcha.
I was assuming the definition of "under the table" in the context of the practice to avoid paying income taxes.
Also, I was confused when you said:
My point was that "fair tax" eliminates the idea and requirement that people "should be paying taxes on income". Your statement seems to contradict. Maybe you are trying to say that people will pay taxes on their income, indirectly, when they purchase stuff. If that is what you are trying to say, then I don't completely agree with that either. I like to think that Fair Tax will totally remove our (perceived) connection between income and taxation.
TJR
Gotcha.
I was assuming the definition of "under the table" in the context of the practice to avoid paying income taxes.
Also, I was confused when you said:
My point was that "fair tax" eliminates the idea and requirement that people "should be paying taxes on income". Your statement seems to contradict. Maybe you are trying to say that people will pay taxes on their income, indirectly, when they purchase stuff. If that is what you are trying to say, then I don't completely agree with that either. I like to think that Fair Tax will totally remove our (perceived) connection between income and taxation.
TJR
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LoriMaury Kimbrough
Active Member
We "get" to pay again this year as well. Everybody said, buy a house so you can claim the interest. Well guess what, we did and we still don't have enough to keep from owing more. Both the hubby and I claim 0 and I have an additional $400/month taken out of my check for taxes. You would think that we made a crap-load of money, but we are still very much middle class.
I get so sick of people bragging about their refunds, mostly because of their kids. What makes them a more deserving citizen than me? Do they deserve to pay less taxes just because they have 3 or 4 kids? I had a child, she's grown now and living on her own so I don't get to claim her anymore. Even when I did, we typcially ended up paying.
Now if that person was serving in the miliatary, that's a whole other case. Lord knows our soldiers deserver any break they can get for what they are doing for us, especially if they are in a hostile environment. I wouldn't mind if they were exempt from taxes while on active duty. I believe they are paying their fair share with their service and below average pay for what they do.
It makes it very hard to get up and go to work every morning. Sometimes I think I'll just give up and let the gov't take care of me too. It seems to work so well for others. What is my motivation to better myself and advance my career if, when I am reward for my accomplishments with a raise, that the money just goes to the feds?
I no problem paying my fair share, but with 47% paying no taxes, there is no way that what I pay is a "fair share". That is why I fully support the fair tax or a national sales tax to replace incomes taxes.
And now there is the idea floating around for a national sales tax ON TOP OF income taxes. I really do need to find a yurt, like someone on here recommended.
I get so sick of people bragging about their refunds, mostly because of their kids. What makes them a more deserving citizen than me? Do they deserve to pay less taxes just because they have 3 or 4 kids? I had a child, she's grown now and living on her own so I don't get to claim her anymore. Even when I did, we typcially ended up paying.
Now if that person was serving in the miliatary, that's a whole other case. Lord knows our soldiers deserver any break they can get for what they are doing for us, especially if they are in a hostile environment. I wouldn't mind if they were exempt from taxes while on active duty. I believe they are paying their fair share with their service and below average pay for what they do.
It makes it very hard to get up and go to work every morning. Sometimes I think I'll just give up and let the gov't take care of me too. It seems to work so well for others. What is my motivation to better myself and advance my career if, when I am reward for my accomplishments with a raise, that the money just goes to the feds?
I no problem paying my fair share, but with 47% paying no taxes, there is no way that what I pay is a "fair share". That is why I fully support the fair tax or a national sales tax to replace incomes taxes.
And now there is the idea floating around for a national sales tax ON TOP OF income taxes. I really do need to find a yurt, like someone on here recommended.
I am an employer. I pay my employee $10.00/hr. He pays taxes and walks away with $6.00/hr worked net income.
I hire a guy under the table and pay him $6.00/hr. He gets the same income and I save $4.00/hr worked.
Enact the fair tax.
I hire a guy legally at $10.00/hr. He works and recieves $10.00 for that hour. He pays his sales tax and makes $6.00 per hour worked.
I hire another guy under the table. I pay him $6.00/hr. He works and recieves $6.00 for that hour. He pays his sales tax and walks away with $2.00
Who is going to work like this? Illegals! They will also pay for schools, police protection, etc. We all succeed and the illegals pay their share.
Tom
I hire a guy under the table and pay him $6.00/hr. He gets the same income and I save $4.00/hr worked.
Enact the fair tax.
I hire a guy legally at $10.00/hr. He works and recieves $10.00 for that hour. He pays his sales tax and makes $6.00 per hour worked.
I hire another guy under the table. I pay him $6.00/hr. He works and recieves $6.00 for that hour. He pays his sales tax and walks away with $2.00
Who is going to work like this? Illegals! They will also pay for schools, police protection, etc. We all succeed and the illegals pay their share.
Tom
Gavin Allan
Well-Known Member
Over six million depend on us to work hard to pay for their welfare benefits. Keep on working and don't complain. We are lucky that now our health care will be free! :bwahaha:
Wes Davis
Well-Known Member
Is there any chance this Fair/Sales Tax thing will ever happen? I am by no means educated on the matter but it just sounds like a good idea to me.
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
Caymen, your scenario I agree with for Fair Tax, I'm concerned about the sketchy nature of the Prebate.
(Though I'd rather there be no income tax, Government could survive without it)
" Maybe you are trying to say that people will pay taxes on their income, indirectly, when they purchase stuff. If that is what you are trying to say"
Yep, that's pretty much what I'm saying. When I decant the issue of income tax, I find that at the core, I just do not like any income tax, even if it is basically a Sales Tax. Better sales than a direct income, if there must be one. Irrational, maybe, but man isn't a rational being to begin with :grin:
Active-Duty military should be tax exempt. Only being in a "combat zone" is a soldier (I guess I should say service-member) exempt from income tax, afaik. Sadly, that does not waive state income tax in the state of residency...MD only exempts the first 15k for military members. Considering that O-1 pulls in, what, ~30k base, that still leads to somewhat brutal taxation.
Oh, you, I and any of us here in the 53% that pays are paying our fair share, see, we're more fortunate than those people who get off from taxes and get handouts for popping out kids like crazy, so it's our duty (COUGH) to pay for them.
(Though I'd rather there be no income tax, Government could survive without it)
" Maybe you are trying to say that people will pay taxes on their income, indirectly, when they purchase stuff. If that is what you are trying to say"
Yep, that's pretty much what I'm saying. When I decant the issue of income tax, I find that at the core, I just do not like any income tax, even if it is basically a Sales Tax. Better sales than a direct income, if there must be one. Irrational, maybe, but man isn't a rational being to begin with :grin:
Active-Duty military should be tax exempt. Only being in a "combat zone" is a soldier (I guess I should say service-member) exempt from income tax, afaik. Sadly, that does not waive state income tax in the state of residency...MD only exempts the first 15k for military members. Considering that O-1 pulls in, what, ~30k base, that still leads to somewhat brutal taxation.
Oh, you, I and any of us here in the 53% that pays are paying our fair share, see, we're more fortunate than those people who get off from taxes and get handouts for popping out kids like crazy, so it's our duty (COUGH) to pay for them.
Bud Williams
Well-Known Member
Wow, is it that low, How's Obama gonna get re-elected with these dismal
numbers?!?:btddhorse:
I paid over $2,500.00 in income tax alone in March. That is right, in the month of March I paid OVER $2,500.00 in FEDERAL income tax alone. This is not counting State income, two local income taxes, FICA, Medicare, etc. This was ONLY Federal Income Tax.
This was not any dividends paid to me, this was from wages and my yearly bonus.
I paid out the ass. Not complaining though. I would rather pay income tax than not pay it. When I pay income tax, that means I have a job. Many people can not say that.
Tom
This was not any dividends paid to me, this was from wages and my yearly bonus.
I paid out the ass. Not complaining though. I would rather pay income tax than not pay it. When I pay income tax, that means I have a job. Many people can not say that.
Tom
Kevin Lang
Well-Known Member
Good point, he needs to bribe at least 51%, come to think of it.
Well, he can console himself that he's almost there. :boohoo:
Galt's Gulch is sounding better and better :grin:
Forget Nostradamus, science fiction has been a far more accurate and precise predictor of the future.
Well, he can console himself that he's almost there. :boohoo:
Galt's Gulch is sounding better and better :grin:
Forget Nostradamus, science fiction has been a far more accurate and precise predictor of the future.
